• Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
  • We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.

plagiarize

It's not a loop. It's a spiral.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
27,542
Cape Cod, MA
I have the same issue with my Samsung Q90r šŸ˜­
Seems like it's not exclusive to LG
For the record I have a 2018 model Q9FN. Consoles connected to the TV, audio goes to my receiver over ARC. Consoles are set to output DD5.1. My receiver is in 'direct' mode to minimize any processing lag there. There is *some* lag for encoding/decoding but it is negligible when compared to connecting my consoles directly to my receiver, or when having my TV output audio. Nothing where audio looks or feels out of sync, as the OP and other people are seeing specifically with DD5.1 on LG TVs (where DTS is fine in comparison, even though that too will have *some* lag from compression and decompression).

My TV won't let me passthrough DTS so I can't try that to see if it makes any difference.
 

Phylyps

Member
Oct 29, 2017
225
Amsterdam
My old Denon amp doesn't have ARC, nevermind eARC, so I'm just running a toslink cable from my CX to the amp. Dolby Digital 5.1 works fine, no delay. I'll take a look at new amps when HDMI 2.1 is widely adopted.
 

_bemusedchunk

Banned
Nov 6, 2019
995
North of Boston
You can't tweak this because the LGs won't let you go negative on the audio delay.




The Sharc goes between the TV and the receiver so HDMI 2.1 support doesn't apply. The intended setup is game console into your TV inputs (so you get your HDMI 2.1 features via TV support), and then audio out via TV->Sharc->Recever/Soundbar using eARC.

The Sharc is basically adding eARC support to receivers and soundbars that don't already have it. If your TV and receiver/soundbar already support eARC then there is no reason for the Sharc.

Ahhh, you are correct.
I did notice that I could change it in my Apple TV, but thats not really related.

Thanks for the clarification!
 
OP
OP
Mike Works

Mike Works

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,775
Thanks for all the replies! So it looks like the cheapest fix is a SHARC.

I'm guessing I want the $150 SHARC model as opposed to the $188 ZONE 2 SHARC? I'm using an LG C9 with a Vizio 5.1 soundbar (wireless subwoofer/rear speakers) and a PS5.
 

CrichtonKicks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,209
Thanks for all the replies! So it looks like the cheapest fix is a SHARC.

I'm guessing I want the $150 SHARC model as opposed to the $188 ZONE 2 SHARC? I'm using an LG C9 with a Vizio 5.1 soundbar (wireless subwoofer/rear speakers) and a PS5.

Yes, I have a similar setup- only difference is that I have a CX and the regular Sharc did the trick.

However did you try DTS? It's not an option for me (CX doesn't support it) but supposedly it really minimizes the lag.
 

mute

ā–² Legend ā–²
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,087
How is a device that goes between the TV and Receiver supposed to help with lag? At that point, isn't the sound already processed (and delayed) by the TV?

Legitimately looking for education, when I used the splitter on my PS4 I put it between there and the TV.
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,056
You can't tweak this because the LGs won't let you go negative on the audio delay.




The Sharc goes between the TV and the receiver so HDMI 2.1 support doesn't apply. The intended setup is game console into your TV inputs (so you get your HDMI 2.1 features via TV support), and then audio out via TV->Sharc->Recever/Soundbar using eARC.

The Sharc is basically adding eARC support to receivers and soundbars that don't already have it. If your TV and receiver/soundbar already support eARC then there is no reason for the Sharc.

I know there is a big thread but wanted to ask a quick one - you can still pass video up through the Sharc? For those devices I have connected to my receiver.
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,056
How is a device that goes between the TV and Receiver supposed to help with lag? At that point, isn't the sound already processed (and delayed) by the TV?

Legitimately looking for education, when I used the splitter on my PS4 I put it between there and the TV.

Its not processing anything - I assume its faking the EDID to say 'hey I'm a receiver with eARC - please send me uncompressed LPCM 5.1' - so the TV does that and it gets piped straight down to your receivers HDMI input. If done well (and it gets good reviews) it should remove almost all lag and improve audio quality
 

CrichtonKicks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,209
How is a device that goes between the TV and Receiver supposed to help with lag? At that point, isn't the sound already processed (and delayed) by the TV?

Legitimately looking for education, when I used the splitter on my PS4 I put it between there and the TV.

The lag comes from Dolby Digital processing inside the LG (even when it's set for Pass Through). So the lag is eliminated by using LPCM 5.1 pass through. LPCM doesn't have the same processing delay as bitstream DD. For all intents and purposes imagine that the LG TV just sits on a Dolby Digital signal for ~100ms while it will immediately pass on a LPCM signal without delay.

However you can only pass through LPCM 5.1 via eARC (regular ARC is limited to 2.0 LPCM). The Sharc will allow you to pass an eARC signal to an audio device that doesn't support it but I don't know what is actually happening inside the Sharc to let that happen.

I know there is a big thread but wanted to ask a quick one - you can still pass video up through the Sharc? For those devices I have connected to my receiver.

I'm not sure, I haven't tried it.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,014
Unfortunately, there are a whole list of issues that can cause this, and it's made worse by the lack of inexpensive HDMI 2.1 hardware out there.
It's not as easy as saying "buy X and it will work" (unless X is a whole new sound system).

If you do not need HDMI 2.1 support, the simplest and least-expensive option is usually to add an HDMI audio extractor between the console and the display.
There are currently no devices that can do this which support HDMI 2.1, and features like VRR potentially complicate matters. An HDMI 2.1 device may be capable of passing through a 4K120 signal, but not advanced features like VRR.

The reason you're only hearing left/right when selecting 5.1 LPCM is because HDMI ARC only has the bandwidth for 2.0 LPCM and the other channels are being dropped (frankly I'm surprised it let you select that).
ARC requires that you use compressed audio (Dolby/DTS) for 5.1.
The problem is that compression/decompression can add a delay to the audio, and some TVsā€”particularly LG OLEDsā€”seem to delay the pass-through of Dolby audio as well.
DTS audio did not suffer from the same delay, but LG have dropped support for DTS in the CX models.

Even if you have a TV which does not delay the audio, some sound bars themselves have a delay when decoding it.
And some sound bars with wireless subwoofers/surround speakers may have an intentional delay so that the wireless speakers play in sync with the rest.
I find it frustrating that no review outlet seems to test audio latency for these devices. Many Atmos devices in particular have a noticeable delay.

eARC allows for 7.1 LPCM pass-through which should bypass the issues of ARC since there is no encoding/decoding, and usually no delay on the pass-through.
Even the LG OLEDs which delay Dolby signals appear to have no delay, or a significantly reduced delay, when passing them through eARC.
But this requires the display and the sound device to both support the eARC signal. It's not backwards compatible.
If your display supports eARC, but not your sound device, there are eARC extractors like the shARC which can convert eARC audio to regular HDMI audio; but many people here have reported issues with the device in their setups - so it's not always going to be as easy as plugging in the device and having the audio work as intended.

Does the shARC support all HDMI 2.1 features like 120 Hz and VRR and introduce no lag? In my current setup (PS5 connected to receiver) I do not get 120 Hz support at 1080p on my LG C8, even though it should be supported. I know HDMI 2.1 is not needed for that, but is it future-proof?
It doesn't need to.
You connect the console directly to the TV, and the shARC to the TV's eARC port.
If your TV does not support eARCā€”and the C8 does notā€”there's very little point in buying the shARC.

I know there is a big thread but wanted to ask a quick one - you can still pass video up through the Sharc? For those devices I have connected to my receiver.
No, it turns the display's eARC port to an HDMI audio output.
It does not pass video through to the TV, and you connect the output of the shARC to an input on your receiver - not the ARC port.

I'm using pcm for my setup and it seems like it's 5.1 to me. Directional sound is there while gaming and when I play a 5.1 test tone on my TV through YouTube it also works and moves to each speaker... I'm so confused now šŸ˜…
YouTube doesn't support 5.1 - so whatever you were hearing was a 2.0 signal.
 

Devil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,662
Are you using bitstream Dolby Digital or LPCM 5.1? If should be the latter if you want to avoid audio sync issues.

I used PCM first but that caused (known) audio issues in games such as missing dialogue in Miles Morales, so I switched to Bitstream. As I posted before, my sync issues were improved after I switched the digital audio setting of the C9 from automatic to manual pass-through. Don't know if it is perfectly synced now but definitely less notable.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,014
Wait what? Are you using that for your gaming systems? It doesn't support any modern video output.
They're probably still using a 1080p display or an HDMI 2.0 audio extractor with an older 4K TV.

I used PCM first but that caused (known) audio issues in games such as missing dialogue in Miles Morales, so I switched to Bitstream. As I posted before, my sync issues were improved after I switched the digital audio setting of the C9 from automatic to manual pass-through. Don't know if it is perfectly synced now but definitely less notable.
That sounds like it doesn't support 5.1 LPCM.
Missing dialog is usually a clear sign that you're only getting the left/right signals and not the center/surrounds/lfe.
 

Devil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,662
They're probably still using a 1080p display or an HDMI 2.0 audio extractor with an older 4K TV.


That sounds like it doesn't support 5.1 LPCM.
Missing dialog is usually a clear sign that you're only getting the left/right signals and not the center/surrounds/lfe.

I use the Sony HT ZF9. It supports LPCM up to 7.1.
 

CrichtonKicks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,209
I used PCM first but that caused (known) audio issues in games such as missing dialogue in Miles Morales, so I switched to Bitstream. As I posted before, my sync issues were improved after I switched the digital audio setting of the C9 from automatic to manual pass-through. Don't know if it is perfectly synced now but definitely less notable.

Did they patch that at some point? I was playing MM last week with 5.1 LPCM and everything including dialogue was working as intended.
 

th1nk

Member
Nov 6, 2017
6,266
Unfortunately, there are a whole list of issues that can cause this, and it's made worse by the lack of inexpensive HDMI 2.1 hardware out there.
It's not as easy as saying "buy X and it will work" (unless X is a whole new sound system).

If you do not need HDMI 2.1 support, the simplest and least-expensive option is usually to add an HDMI audio extractor between the console and the display.
There are currently no devices that can do this which support HDMI 2.1, and features like VRR potentially complicate matters. An HDMI 2.1 device may be capable of passing through a 4K120 signal, but not advanced features like VRR.

The reason you're only hearing left/right when selecting 5.1 LPCM is because HDMI ARC only has the bandwidth for 2.0 LPCM and the other channels are being dropped (frankly I'm surprised it let you select that).
ARC requires that you use compressed audio (Dolby/DTS) for 5.1.
The problem is that compression/decompression can add a delay to the audio, and some TVsā€”particularly LG OLEDsā€”seem to delay the pass-through of Dolby audio as well.
DTS audio did not suffer from the same delay, but LG have dropped support for DTS in the CX models.

Even if you have a TV which does not delay the audio, some sound bars themselves have a delay when decoding it.
And some sound bars with wireless subwoofers/surround speakers may have an intentional delay so that the wireless speakers play in sync with the rest.
I find it frustrating that no review outlet seems to test audio latency for these devices. Many Atmos devices in particular have a noticeable delay.

eARC allows for 7.1 LPCM pass-through which should bypass the issues of ARC since there is no encoding/decoding, and usually no delay on the pass-through.
Even the LG OLEDs which delay Dolby signals appear to have no delay, or a significantly reduced delay, when passing them through eARC.
But this requires the display and the sound device to both support the eARC signal. It's not backwards compatible.
If your display supports eARC, but not your sound device, there are eARC extractors like the shARC which can convert eARC audio to regular HDMI audio; but many people here have reported issues with the device in their setups - so it's not always going to be as easy as plugging in the device and having the audio work as intended.


It doesn't need to.
You connect the console directly to the TV, and the shARC to the TV's eARC port.
If your TV does not support eARCā€”and the C8 does notā€”there's very little point in buying the shARC.


No, it turns the display's eARC port to an HDMI audio output.
It does not pass video through to the TV, and you connect the output of the shARC to an input on your receiver - not the ARC port.


YouTube doesn't support 5.1 - so whatever you were hearing was a 2.0 signal.
Thank you! I guess I will not be playing 120 fps mode on my LG C8, then. :/
 

Devil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,662
Did they patch that at some point? I was playing MM last week with 5.1 LPCM and everything including dialogue was working as intended.

Maybe. I'll have to try switching to LPCM again and start the game. Maybe it was game specific? I read more complaints from other users around the time of the european PS5 launch though.
 
Last edited:

headspawn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,608
Do you have any 'sound modes' activated with your soundbar? I've never used that particular soundbar myself but last year when I visited my brother, his soundbar seemed off to me, he had it on some mode called like 'Super 3D: Game Mode' or something. I basically, just turned all of his shit to 'Off' and it worked fine after that.
 

AtomicShroom

Tools & Automation
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
3,078
Did they patch that at some point? I was playing MM last week with 5.1 LPCM and everything including dialogue was working as intended.

It was never broken. As Pargon posted above, many people are incorrectly configuring their PS5s to send 5.1 LPCM to devices that don't support it (i.e. their TV) and end up dropping the extra channels, resulting in missing audio, and incorrectly blaming the game or the PS5. It's simply a matter of properly configuring your PS5 audio settings. One could argue that the problem is the PS5 not auto-detecting this properly, but I'm not sure if that's possible or not.
 

infinityBCRT

Member
Nov 1, 2017
1,132
Don't have that lag issue. Getting Surround over ARC (believe its DTS but have to double check) with my Onkyo receiver. But one issue I do have is my KS8000 keeps on wanting to reset itself into 2.0 PCM mode. I believe it's my PS5 causing this, as I never noticed having this issue before the PS5. It ends up resetting my cable box input into this mode as well. But curiously my Receiver input (where my Atmos devices such as Series X & Apple TV are) stays in the appropriate mode for Atmos.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,014
Thank you! I guess I will not be playing 120 fps mode on my LG C8, then. :/
It just occurred to me: you don't need HDMI 2.1 for 1080p120 - or at least you should not, unless the PS5 is weird about it.
HDMI 2.0 has no problem with this, so you should be able to use a regular 18gbps audio extractor - though it's possible that not all of them will do it.
 

th1nk

Member
Nov 6, 2017
6,266
It just occurred to me: you don't need HDMI 2.1 for 1080p120 - or at least you should not, unless the PS5 is weird about it.
HDMI 2.0 has no problem with this, so you should be able to use a regular 18gbps audio extractor - though it's possible that not all of them will do it.
Yeah thanks for thinking about it. Though it will most likely be hard to find a compatible one that introduces no additional lag. Actually I hoped that it would work through my Denon receiver, as it passes through most other signals. But I guess the PS5 does not recognize the compatibility correctly...
 

SimpleCRIPPLE

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,224
Just bought a new TV and receiver so I could solve my sync issues w/ eARC. Of course now eARC has it's own stability problems, but at least my audio/video is in sync.

Previously had a Q9FN and Onkyo receiver, now have a Sony X90CH and Yamaha TSR-700 receiver (they work pretty well together, but occasionally lose audio when switching sources and need to reboot).
 

dosh

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,259
How is your system set-up OP? A friend of mine had a similar audio lag issue with his PS4. Turns out he had plugged it directly to the TV, which then output sound to the sound bar.

We changed that to PS4 -> sound bar -> TV, and no more audio lag.
 

KyngKee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
886
I have a delay, but I'm using optical from my Vizio 5.1 soundbar through to my TCL TV. I'm going to upgrade to a 2.1 HMDI tv soon and definitely need some audio recommendations that aren't going to cost me a ton...
 

Deleted member 88324

User requested account closure
Banned
Dec 17, 2020
6
I've also had some issues with getting sound to work as it should with C9 and ARC.
When trying to watch the built-in webOS apps like Netflix or Disney+, all I would hear was this loud clicking sort of sound, so I assume there's some incorrect decoding somewhere in the process.

So then I switched to optical instead (consoles -> TV -> optical to receiver) and surround seems to work fine everywhere, but with a slight delay as mentioned by others here.

I want to try the DTS fix since I have a C9 TV. How do I change it to output in DTS?
 

CrichtonKicks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,209
How is your system set-up OP? A friend of mine had a similar audio lag issue with his PS4. Turns out he had plugged it directly to the TV, which then output sound to the sound bar.

We changed that to PS4 -> sound bar -> TV, and no more audio lag.

That will solve the audio delay issues but you cannot get any HDMI 2.1 features using that method.

I have a delay, but I'm using optical from my Vizio 5.1 soundbar through to my TCL TV. I'm going to upgrade to a 2.1 HMDI tv soon and definitely need some audio recommendations that aren't going to cost me a ton...

You will either need to either use LPCM Stereo sound, invest in a new audio setup that supports eARC, or buy a ShARC adapter ($150). And make sure your TV supports eARC but I'm assuming any HDMI 2.1 capable TV would have that.
 

chipperrip

Member
Jan 29, 2019
433
I wish there was an industry voice that could convince the content distributor boomers that it's time to nuke HDCP.

As far as I can tell HDCP has done absolutely fuck-all to thwart piracy and "unintended use". It has only made consumer media centers extra expensive and difficult to set up correctly.
 

thehorror

Banned
Nov 29, 2017
119
I noticed the same thing with GoT on my headphones.

Did you try other games OP? Other games are fine for me, just GoT the mouths aren't voicing the audio in sync it seems.
 

Relix

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,222
Same soundbar, C7 instead. No delay at all. PCM here. PS5 to TV and ARC to soundbar.
 

Pargon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,014
Yeah thanks for thinking about it. Though it will most likely be hard to find a compatible one that introduces no additional lag. Actually I hoped that it would work through my Denon receiver, as it passes through most other signals. But I guess the PS5 does not recognize the compatibility correctly...
I've only tested a limited sample size here, but none of the HDMI splitters/matrix switchers/audio extractors I've used added any delay to the video (measured with a lag tester).

I don't know whether that will let your PS5 output 1080p120 over HDMI though.
Some TVs support a 1080p120 input, but do not list it in the EDID so it can only be forced via a PC, or with a device that lets you edit the EDID.

My setup is just fine.
LG CX 65"
Sonos Beam soundbar.
2 Sonos Symfonisk bookshelves for surrounds.
Dolby audio works just fine.

as mentioned earlier, you can tweak the sound settings to manually sync it up.
Good luck with that!
LG OLEDs have about 100ms delay when passing through Dolby audio signals in Game Mode.
Well, they have about a 100ms delay at all times, but the TV itself delays the picture by about 100ms outside of Game Mode, so it syncs up.
You're either not using Game Mode, or aren't noticing the delay (and that's without factoring in any additional delay the Sonos wireless speakers may add).

Same soundbar, C7 instead. No delay at all. PCM here. PS5 to TV and ARC to soundbar.
The issue is that LPCM will limit you to stereo over ARC, rather than surround sound.
 

padlock

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
867
I've got a C9 and JBL 9.1 sound bar connected through earc. I have my XSX set to output DTS X Neural and my TV set to passthrough, am am not getting delay. I also tried setting the XSX to Atmos. That also doesn't have delay, but for some reason, I will completely loose audio occasionally and the only way to get it back is to power cycle the sound bar, so I'm sticking with DTS for now.
 

th1nk

Member
Nov 6, 2017
6,266
I've only tested a limited sample size here, but none of the HDMI splitters/matrix switchers/audio extractors I've used added any delay to the video (measured with a lag tester).

I don't know whether that will let your PS5 output 1080p120 over HDMI though.
Some TVs support a 1080p120 input, but do not list it in the EDID so it can only be forced via a PC, or with a device that lets you edit the EDID.


LG OLEDs have about 100ms delay when passing through Dolby audio signals in Game Mode.
Well, they have about a 100ms delay at all times, but the TV itself delays the picture by about 100ms outside of Game Mode, so it syncs up.
You're either not using Game Mode, or aren't noticing the delay (and that's without factoring in any additional delay the Sonos wireless speakers may add).


The issue is that LPCM will limit you to stereo over ARC, rather than surround sound.

Yeah I just checked and the PS5 does not recognize that the LG C8 supports 1080p120, even when directly connected to the TV. Oh well, I am super happy with all the 4k60 games anyway, but would have liked to check it out. Maybe I will splurge on a 77C1 at the end of the year... if it supports 1000 Nits. Hyped for CES! :) Thanks again, Pargon!
 

Lionheart

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,842
I have a sharc with ps5 and have this issue as well, it's really annoying. I wonder if i set my avr to a negative delay for lipsync will it fix the issue. I used sharc on ps4 and didn't notice this
 

KyngKee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
886
That will solve the audio delay issues but you cannot get any HDMI 2.1 features using that method.



You will either need to either use LPCM Stereo sound, invest in a new audio setup that supports eARC, or buy a ShARC adapter ($150). And make sure your TV supports eARC but I'm assuming any HDMI 2.1 capable TV would have that.

My delay is weird. It'll happen with my TV apps like HBO Max and Netflix occasionally. With my PS5 and Xbox it's noticeable in some games more than others. I know nothing about audio and surround sound. I bought the Vizio 5.1 soundbar to simplify it for me since I don't like gaming with headsets. I'll have to make sure my PS5 and XSX are set to LPCM. The soundbar has a AV delay setting I use when it's really bad, but I have to reset it depending on what I'm watching or playing on the TV. Had no idea about eARC so glad I saw this thread before I started shopping around for my new audio setup when I get my 2.1 HDMI TV soon thanks...
 

SimpleCRIPPLE

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,224
I have a sharc with ps5 and have this issue as well, it's really annoying. I wonder if i set my avr to a negative delay for lipsync will it fix the issue. I used sharc on ps4 and didn't notice this
I didn't have any issues w/ Dolby Digital and PS4, only Xbox One. I was disappointed to discover the PS5 has the same lag issue with Dolby that the Xbox One had last gen. DTS clears it up, but not all TV's support DTS passthrough which sucks for those that don't use a receiver.