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All Elite Wrestling |OT9| Where We’re Going We Don’t Need Rhodes

WowCoolRobot

WowCoolRobot

Member
Aug 15, 2021
1,568
I'd love Angelico to stay and get more shine in high profile technical matches, but if this is also the end of his time in AEW I hope we at least get to see a couple things:
  • Angeilco vs Danielson on his way out
  • TH2 vs FTR for the AAA belts some time down the road
 
EvilDead1987

EvilDead1987

Member
Nov 4, 2021
2,117
South Eastern PA
mtlspider said:
I can't imagine Angelico will be in for long either.
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Classicrock78 said:
So what's happening with Angelico now that Jack Evans is gone will they resign him or let him go,I don't know how long his contract is left.
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Rumors have said that Angelico signed a new deal or got his current one extended. Can't say if they are correct, but Angelico did appear on Elevation on Monday. He's been injured for the last 5-6 months.

Shaneus said:
Does no-one remember this?
the-revival-repackage-plans-1024x576.jpg


They ain't going nowhere. Especially if they have more of a chance working with Bret at AEW than anywhere else.

On that note, can anyone explain Hitman's relationships with AEW and WWE? I know he appeared at Double or Nothing in 2019, but since then I thought he was in WWE's orbit again for some reason.
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I wasn't watching at the time, but supposedly FTR were in a feud with The Usos about shaving their backs? That definitely screams "I'm going back to WWE" lol I'm sure their saying their goodbyes to the AEW locker room as we speak lol

To answer your second part. I don't think Bret is on bad terms with either company. He's got family that still works in WWE, so I'm sure he plays nice with them. I don't think he's on a Legends contract, because he's appearing at some indie show to manage FTR. I haven't watched WWE in a long time, but I don't think he's been on anything since the Pandemic.

Supposedly, Ric Flair was going to debut The World Title at the first Double or Nothing. They got Bret instead, because Flair couldn't make it due to his health or something.
 
milamber182

milamber182

Member
Dec 15, 2017
7,710
Australia
Pretty good promos on Road to Pittsburgh by talent not known for their promos skills. Plus Dustin and Punk got me invested in their match.

Most entertaining Dark in a long time.
 
Fitts

Fitts

You know what that means
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,161
It's Wednesday. You know what that means. 💜💜

Can't believe it's 🧨 day already. The combination of BotB on Saturday and a holiday on Sunday has my days all messed up.
 
SpaceSong

SpaceSong

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,010
Toli08 said:
I agree with you. I think people put too much emphasis on putting on great matches. That is important but the casual fan gets hooked on the storytelling and peoples personalities way more then the actual in ring work.

Imo you hook people with the stories and characters and then get them to enjoy the matches.
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No one's saying the women need more 5* performances to be legitimized.

We're saying they just need *MATCHES*.

They're either getting rusty going unused or not getting the reps they need doing pointless squahes on Dark.

I don't know why this is hard to understand for some. The great stuff will be in between and down the line if they just get to wrestle and are doing more interesting things storytelling wise. I'd rather see the women wrestle than the burden out onto a few good talkers.
 
eonden

eonden

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,076
AEW Women division doesnt even need matches (they have quite a few in total with Dark / Elevation). What they need is actual stories around the characters that build up feuds. If you just have random matches, regardless of quality, the division will be forever stucked into the "i dont care".
 
SpaceSong

SpaceSong

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,010
Elevation and Dark are barely matches for anyone on those shows. Give me a break over here...

And if the matches aren't informing stories, which with few exceptions - they haven't, then we have pretty much what they're doing now by having a short feud and then everyone involved just disappears and the story they told didn't matter. Where did Penny and Allie go? Anna? Tay is a prop for Sammy now. That probably leads to an awkward match with PVZ!

Matches. I don't know why anyone would think I'm saying skip the story telling here. That comes with the deal. They just have to be doing real matches.
 
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Rivenblade

Rivenblade

Member
Nov 1, 2017
37,118
Happy Dynamite Day.


Match order predictions:

1. CM Punk vs. Dustin Rhodes
2. JB vs. KOR
3. Wardlow vs. Butcher
4. Britt vs. Danielle (top of the hour for Britt's return)
5. Unannounced match that Tony will drop on Twitter at some point today
6. Darby vs. Andrade

Probably something involving JAS and Eddie to hype up Eddie vs. Daniel Garcia on Rampage, and something involving Jade and Marina Shafir, too. Oh! And you've gotta do something with the BCC even if it's just a pre-tape or backstage segment. And FTR/ReDragon/Jurassic Express. Maybe something with the Young Bucks, or Lee and Sw3rve? Ricky would be great, too. Hmm. A lot of irons in the fire right now.

Screw it, add Ricky vs. Lee to this card, please, or another meaningful women's match.
 
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eonden

eonden

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,076
SpaceSong said:
Elevation and Dark are barely matches for anyone on those shows. Give me a break over here...

And if the matches aren't informing stories, which with few exceptions - they haven't, then we have pretty much what they're doing now by having a short feud and then everyone involved just disappears and the story they told didn't matter. Where did Penny and Allie go? Anna? Tay is a prop for Sammy now. That probably leads to an awkward match with PVZ!

Matches. I don't know why anyone would think I'm saying skip the story telling here. That comes with the deal. They just have to be doing real matches.
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Yeah, my point is that even if AEW adds more women matches, it is meaningless if they dont actually build around the matches some compelling stories. We had the same hope in the last women tournament for the TBS title with several matches and a decent structure where we hoped there would be several storylines... but it ended up being mostly one note of good matches with little meaning in actually helping build around them.
 
SpaceSong

SpaceSong

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,010
eonden said:
Yeah, my point is that even if AEW adds more women matches, it is meaningless if they dont actually build around the matches some compelling stories.
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It's super frustrating that you think I'm implying more matches means skipping the story part. The women don't get over by never being on TV. They get over putting on wrestling matches for the wrestling fans on the wrestling show. Pretty simple logic I'm working on here.
 
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Dirtyshubb

Dirtyshubb

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,555
UK
Kurita said:
Next you're gonna tell me that matches can be vessels to build stories!!!
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While that is true, to actually get over you need more than that.

You need promos, interview segments, post match promos/beatdowns etc.

It's all good furthering a story in a match, that has its place, but for the most part you move the narrative along with compelling segments and promos as that helps get the characters over, gets the audience engaged and helps things flow.

It's why the women's matches typically have no heat, because the matches feel meaningless to the audience or they just aren't engaged enough with the characters. You get a few exceptions like Rosa and Britt but otherwise a lot of the womens matches are the quiet portions of the shows.
 
SpaceSong

SpaceSong

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,010
Dirtyshubb said:
While that is true, to actually get over you need more than that.

You need promos, interview segments, post match promos/beatdowns etc.

It's all good furthering a story in a match, that has its place, but for the most part you move the narrative along with compelling segments and promos as that helps get the characters over, gets the audience engaged and helps things flow.

It's why the women's matches typically have no heat, because the matches feel meaningless to the audience or they just aren't engaged enough with the characters. You get a few exceptions like Rosa and Britt but otherwise a lot of the womens matches are the quiet portions of the shows.
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You're working on the logic that they must get over.

I'm working on the logic that they are already capable of that and just need the screen time to do so.
 
cjelly

cjelly

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,225
Rivenblade said:
Happy Dynamite Day.


Match order predictions:

1. CM Punk vs. Dustin Rhodes
2. JB vs. KOR
3. Wardlow vs. Butcher
4. Britt vs. Danielle (top of the hour for Britt's return)
5. Unannounced match that Tony will drop on Twitter at some point today
6. Darby vs. Andrade

Probably something involving JAS and Eddie to hype up Eddie vs. Daniel Garcia on Rampage, and something involving Jade and Marina Shafir, too. Oh! And you've gotta do something with the BCC even if it's just a pre-tape or backstage segment. And FTR/ReDragon/Jurassic Express. Maybe something with the Young Bucks, or Lee and Sw3rve? Ricky would be great, too. Hmm. A lot of irons in the fire right now.

Screw it, add Ricky vs. Lee to this card, please, or another meaningful women's match.
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Punk has proven he's a draw so it's silly to keep putting him first.

I say open with Britt, put Punk/Dustin end of 1st hour / beginning of second hour. Main event is Andrade/Darby.

Saying that, they might wanna start Punk/Hangman tonight so Punk might go on last.
 
Dirtyshubb

Dirtyshubb

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,555
UK
SpaceSong said:
You're working on the logic that they must get over.

I'm working on the logic that they are already capable of that and just need the screen time to do so.
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Screen time is obviously important but if you just fill that with matches it won't mean much in the long run.

Having them and promos etc is what will help the women's division as the stories end up being spread out or just simply aren't progressed enough as it currently is.
 
Serpens007

Serpens007

Well, Tosca isn't for everyone
Moderator
Oct 31, 2017
8,123
Chile
Toli08 said:
I agree with you. I think people put too much emphasis on putting on great matches. That is important but the casual fan gets hooked on the storytelling and peoples personalities way more then the actual in ring work.

Imo you hook people with the stories and characters and then get them to enjoy the matches.
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But

1- That's what "give them more time" means. How can there be stories and characters when they have a combined less than 30 minutes of TV time a week in a 3 hour space?

2- How can then people get to enjoy matches when there are two a week, at best, and they last nothing?

When we've had great matches there has been nothing following them to make people stay caring because they don't get enough time. It's as simple as that. We had Anna, Tay, Bunny and Penelope having a story and ending it in an amazing match and then... nothing? And now Tay is with PVZ in the worst feud AEW has to offer around the men.

We had the 5 minutes professor challenge and then Shida poped and then... nothing?

Right now the women's division is booked as something that matters less than the rest of the show, of course the audience won't care. It's WWE booking - minus the mysoginistic emphasis on T&A thankfully - at its finest.
 
El-Suave

El-Suave

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,829
If the coffin match has a coffin drop into the coffin again I hope they design the coffin a lot better. There were so many unneeded sharp edges on the last coffins lid, Darby could have torn up his back really easily if he was a few centimeters off. That thing needs to be built much more wrestler friendly if they keep doing that move.

Edit: And for the women's division - those qualifying matches are useless unless they don't plan a big upset to justify all these glorified Dark matches. That shit is completely blocking storytelling.
 
SpaceSong

SpaceSong

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,010
Dirtyshubb said:
Screen time is obviously important but if you just fill that with matches it won't mean much in the long run.

Having them and promos etc is what will help the women's division as the stories end up being spread out or just simply aren't progressed enough as it currently is.
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I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. You're saying what I'm saying back to me like you've made a point.

I'm saying you don't have to create another Britt or Jade. They don't have to be forced on us until they get over. I'm saying you can get them on screen wrestling, telling stories, NOT DISAPEARING ONCE THEY'RE DONE, this part keeps happening, cuz they need those things to get better at the getting over part in the first place. And the ones that can get over will do it cuz they already have what it takes to do so.
 
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Dirtyshubb

Dirtyshubb

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,555
UK
SpaceSong said:
I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. You're saying what I'm saying back to me like you've made a point.

I'm saying you don't have to create another Britt or Jade. They don't have to be forced on us until they get over. I'm saying you can get them on screen wrestling, telling stories, NOT DISAPEARING ONCE THEY'RE DONE, this part keeps happening, cuz they need those things to get better at the getting over part in the first place. And the ones that can get over will do it cuz they already have that it takes to do so.
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Lol seems like we were talking past each other.

But yeah, it's clear what is needed to help the division so all we can do is wait and see what happens because something obviously needs to change.
 
OfficerRob

OfficerRob

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,077
I was expecting a better build-up and break down of the importance of the Owen tournament. At this point these qualifying matches are just kinda happening, and are the worst thing on the shows. Not at all what I wanted
 
Rivenblade

Rivenblade

Member
Nov 1, 2017
37,118
cjelly said:
Punk has proven he's a draw so it's silly to keep putting him first.

I say open with Britt, put Punk/Dustin end of 1st hour / beginning of second hour. Main event is Andrade/Darby.

Saying that, they might wanna start Punk/Hangman tonight so Punk might go on last.
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It would be nice if they shook things up a bit with what you're suggesting. Britt match followed by a promo would be rad. I'm assuming they'll fire up her next program...but she'll probably just talk about the Owen. We'll see.

And yeah, they really gotta get Hangman on this show, too! Can't believe I didn't mention him above.
 
Serpens007

Serpens007

Well, Tosca isn't for everyone
Moderator
Oct 31, 2017
8,123
Chile
Rivenblade said:
It would be nice if they shook things up a bit with what you're suggesting. Britt match followed by a promo would be rad. I'm assuming they'll fire up her next program...but she'll probably just talk about the Owen. We'll see.

And yeah, they really gotta get Hangman on this show, too! Can't believe I didn't mention him above.
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Hangman posted an Instagram story and he was in Pittsburgh, so I'm sure he'll be there (or Rampage)
 
AstralSphere

AstralSphere

Member
Feb 10, 2021
8,958
I have a big issue with the Owen tourney so far. I don't recall seeing anyone else mention it so it's probably very much a me thing though.

These qualifying matches are kinda just happening seemingly at random, and it's hard to invest in the tournament being a big deal when it's presented that way. Unless I've missed an official tweet or something, we don't know who is taking part (aside from those who have already won their qualifying matches), we don't know what the knockout tree looks like, and have they even said how many are taking part in either of the men's or women's sides?

Forgive me if this is info I simply missed, but this is the big thing that makes it feel less special so far than something like the G1. As of right now it just feels like TK booking random matches and tagging the Owen branding on them. I know that isn't what is actually happening, but I feel like the presentation so far has been extremely lacking and could feel a lot more special.

I'm hoping that at least once the qualifying matches are over that they do a big run down and announcement of who is facing who and what the bracket looks like.

OfficerRob said:
I was expecting a better build-up and break down of the importance of the Owen tournament. At this point these qualifying matches are just kinda happening, and are the worst thing on the shows. Not at all what I wanted
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Oh shit, I missed your post. I'm not alone!
 
Carnby

Carnby

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,236
Here's what I'm thinking happens next with the world title.

Double or Nothing: CM Punk v Hang Man. Punk wins.
All Out: CM Punk v MJF. MJF wins.

Then MJF holds toe belt until the end of 2023. He loses it after he signs with WWE. I'm not sure who he would lose it too.
 
data west

data west

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,008
The MJF/Punk feud made me think about other 'future versions of myself' feuds, and I really want Fenix to be the guy to have Rey's last match(obviously it'll be Dominick though) but I feel like Fenix is the closest we ever got to a new Rey Mysterio

Edi98DgUwAAP5TB.jpg
 
Rivenblade

Rivenblade

Member
Nov 1, 2017
37,118
Jon Moxley has been the best AEW world champion.





Bonus in the fourth video is HOOK wearing MJF's burberry scarf to cover up his mouth as part of MJF's crew.

I know part of this was made necessary by the pandemic, but there really is no reason for Hangman not to be cutting promos like this every week or two.
 
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Normanski 2.0

Member
Nov 21, 2017
3,261
SpaceSong said:
No one's saying the women need more 5* performances to be legitimized.

We're saying they just need *MATCHES*.

They're either getting rusty going unused or not getting the reps they need doing pointless squahes on Dark.

I don't know why this is hard to understand for some. The great stuff will be in between and down the line if they just get to wrestle and are doing more interesting things storytelling wise. I'd rather see the women wrestle than the burden out onto a few good talkers.
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I'm not saying you're wrong but I think people forget that AEW talent isn't locked to only working AEW shows.

Now things are back open there's really no reason for people to be getting rusty from being unused, they are completely free to keep sharp by working on the indies.
 
Habs

Habs

Member
Mar 10, 2021
1,539
Rivenblade said:
Jon Moxley has been the best AEW world champion.





I know part of this was made necessary by the pandemic, but there really is no reason for Hangman not to be cutting promos like this every week or two.
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Yes he was.

Hopefully it starts now. If he feuds against Punk there is no way around it.
 
Rivenblade

Rivenblade

Member
Nov 1, 2017
37,118
Looking back at some early Will Hobbs stuff.

His AEW debut. You can hear how impressed Taz is already. Had totally forgotten that his AEW debut was against...Orange Cassidy? @_@


Pretty sure this is the first time the word "Powerhouse" is used to describe Hobbs. And it was said in passing by Taz.


Incredible how far his physique has come.
 
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