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Shpeshal Nick

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,856
Melbourne, Australia
To be quite honest in situations like this I don't think there is anything an accused person can say that will make them look better, other than producing some massive receipts that cast serious doubt on the accusations (EXTREMELY unlikely to happen).

This is kind of what I was getting at.

Like, if I was accused of something tomorrow on Twitter that wasn't true, what am I supposed to say? What am I supposed to do? It seems like I'm screwed no matter what.
 

Inquisitive_Ghost

Cranky Ghost Pokemon
Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,120
Dammit. I love the Fallen London universe, and Cultist Simulator is the only game I've ever helped crowdfund. I was going to contribute to Book of Hours because an occult library sim sounds straight up my alley, but I guess I won't be doing that now.

I'm glad he's no longer with Failbetter, at least. Hope the victims get the support they need.
 

filkry

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,892
Can't open twitter (in China atm). What's it about? Already stopped thinking about Miegakure since a while ago but still.

The abusers & predators who prey on young, naive, new, and eager folks in the industry, who are the most vulnerable of all, are the worst offenders IMO. They're all terrible, but it takes a special kind of awful to actively seek out people who should be uplifted, and target them.

I experienced this at my FIRST networking event, as a 21 year old still in college, interning for two companies. I was asked by one company to help throw a PAX East party. I was so excited to be taken seriously, to be asked to help, and to get to network and make friends.

I was nervous and did my best to social and be genuine. Finally one person started talking to me about art, they took art seriously too! They wanted to know about what I did. We had an in depth discussion about our passions, I was so glad I made a "friend".

Over the course of the night, this person kept getting way too close. Kept trying to buy me drinks. Kept touching me and putting his arm around me. It was clear to me then he had no intention of treating me as a professional. I kept ducking away and talking to other. He followed.

I knew this person was a "someone" in the industry and did my best to rebuff his advances with friendliness and professionalism, afraid of what would happen if I told him off or made a scene. He wouldn't go away. I sat down and he sat next to me and wrapped his arm around me.

I was frozen with fear and too scared to run away as he held me there and flirted and made lewd comments. I frantically texted my boyfriend asking him to pick me up. Everyone at the party ignored my frantic panicked eye contact and what was happening. No one helped.

As I go to run out, I ask some people I recognize to please make sure he doesn't follow me out. They make a face and laugh at my suggestion. I am horrified and get into my boyfriends car, absolutely stunned at how dehumanized I felt and how no one helped me. I am scared of him.

The next day, he comes to the PAX East booth I'm working at, asking me to tour the floor with him. I tell him I'm working and don't have time. I am scared and nervous and can't focus on doing my job. At a party that night, people jokingly point him out to me as I duck and hide.

I go to an indie dev meetup sometime later, never having gone before. I know maybe two people, eager to meet people and make friends. Someone I don't know picks me out of the crowd and goes "You're Carrie, right? Marc is a good guy. I heard about that!" and joked!

Not only did no one stop the harassment as it happened, they fucking joked about it after. Didn't take me seriously. Gossiped. I was mortified and humiliated. I just wanted to make games and be taken seriously. I didn't feel safe. I didn't attend again.

I rarely go to events to this day because of this. Of fearing for my physical safety, of people ignoring harassment as it happens. The times I do go, I am dehumanized, sexualised, touched. No one steps in. I continue to go in hopes of protecting some other woman being targeted.

To you "allies" out there who talk a big game but turn a blind eye to harassment, you're terrible and are part of the problem. Remembering this incident to this day makes my blood fucking boil at all the complacency, at letting me be a target.

I turn this anger into being outspoken against this behavior, to hopefully be loud and visible enough to be an ally to other targets in trouble. I hate how it made me feel so inhuman and I don't want others to feel that way, EVER. I am angry for them all.

I have no idea what he's doing now. As far as I can tell...he's working on the same game he was telling me about back then. Go figure. In any case, Marc Ten Bosh can go fuck himself. I have never felt so inhuman and objectified and I nearly left because of it.
 

stupei

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,801
This is kind of what I was getting at.

Like, if I was accused of something tomorrow on Twitter that wasn't true, what am I supposed to say? What am I supposed to do? It seems like I'm screwed no matter what.

I never understand this kind of fear mongering. It's entirely irrational.

If you were accused of doing something that is entirely out of character, that you would never do, then there's no reason to respond in a guilty manner. Presumably you have met people in your lifetime who would defend you if you were accused of behavior that is completely out of character and not, as is the case here, instead have many, many people come forward to say, actually, not only is this completely in character, but they know of other instances of it happening and have heard of it for many years.

This isn't ever just a single tweet from a single person. Basically every single time lots and lots of people come forward to say that it matches a pattern of behavior and to corroborate accounts. This hand wringing some people seem compelled toward makes genuinely no sense whatsoever. If you're an innocent person, you won't have a pattern of guilty behavior for tons of people to point to and say "look at this shit," so you don't have to imagine how you would react to such an event. It's not going to happen to you. So why worry?

It's a bizarre impulse to shift the topic to yourself and focus on your own imagined victimization instead of the actual victims on record.
 

TimFL

Member
Oct 28, 2017
239
Germany
I never understand this kind of fear mongering. It's entirely irrational.

If you were accused of doing something that is entirely out of character, that you would never do, then there's no reason to respond in a guilty manner. Presumably you have met people in your lifetime who would defend you if you were accused of behavior that is completely out of character and not, as is the case here, instead have many, many people come forward to say, actually, not only is this completely in character, but they know of other instances of it happening and have heard of it for many years.

This isn't ever just a single tweet from a single person. Basically every single time lots and lots of people come forward to say that it matches a pattern of behavior and to corroborate accounts. This hand wringing some people seem compelled toward makes genuinely no sense whatsoever. If you're an innocent person, you won't have a pattern of guilty behavior for tons of people to point to and say "look at this shit," so you don't have to imagine how you would react to such an event. It's not going to happen to you. So why worry?

It's a bizarre impulse to shift the topic to yourself and focus on your own imagined victimization instead of the actual victims on record.
These things happen though, so it's not really an irrational fear. An acquaintance of me was accused of rape years ago, lost almost everything. Turns out she lied (bragged about it years later). He never recovered from that.

That being said, it was a he say, she say situation (and one could argue the girl was crazy).
This looks to be a they say, he says situation so there's more fire (more truth maybe?) to the case. Needless to say I'm not going to call anyone out for l
 

Sibylus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,728
This is a good thread that bears sharing on why this information being public is so important (and it has nothing to do with sending pitchfork mobs after the accused).

 

Shpeshal Nick

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,856
Melbourne, Australia
This isn't ever just a single tweet from a single person. Basically every single time lots and lots of people come forward to say that it matches a pattern of behavior and to corroborate accounts. This hand wringing some people seem compelled toward makes genuinely no sense whatsoever. If you're an innocent person, you won't have a pattern of guilty behavior for tons of people to point to and say "look at this shit," so you don't have to imagine how you would react to such an event. It's not going to happen to you. So why worry?

Good point
 

dock

Game Designer
Verified
Nov 5, 2017
1,367
To the people angry about 'whispers' and wanting to end 'open secrets', what do you suggest?

I am connected well enough to have previously heard warnings about AK, but it wasn't my information to make public. I have never met him. Confidential info is a means for me to stay wary and protect those close to me. Reputations like this happen all the time in every industry.
 

Mio

Member
Oct 16, 2018
117
To be quite honest in situations like this I don't think there is anything an accused person can say that will make them look better, other than producing some massive receipts that cast serious doubt on the accusations (EXTREMELY unlikely to happen).

Nolan Bushnell dealt with the accusation of sexism he received very professionally and in an emphatic way.

He basically admitted being wrong, despite most of his former employers defending him.

This is what he stated:

I applaud the GDC for ensuring that their institution reflects what is right, specifically with regards to how people should be treated in the workplace. And if that means an award is the price I have to pay personally so the whole industry may be more aware of sensitive to these issues, I applaud that, too. If my personal actions or other actions of anyone who ever worked with me offended or caused pain to anyone at our companies, then I apologize without reservation.
 

Mio

Member
Oct 16, 2018
117
"If my personal actions…"
Nolan Bushnell almost had an apology there!

From what I have read when I followed this, he wasn't accused by any of his former employers, but the issue was raised by people aware of how things were run when he managed Atari.

I don't want to derail the topic nor defend Bushnell, I just wanted to point that if you are accused of something, even if you believe you are in the right, the best thing to do is to apologize.

"If somebody was hurt by my action, please accept my apologies."

I think it's a very nice sentence.
 

VN1X

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
2,027
I never understand this kind of fear mongering. It's entirely irrational.

If you were accused of doing something that is entirely out of character, that you would never do, then there's no reason to respond in a guilty manner. Presumably you have met people in your lifetime who would defend you if you were accused of behavior that is completely out of character and not, as is the case here, instead have many, many people come forward to say, actually, not only is this completely in character, but they know of other instances of it happening and have heard of it for many years.

This isn't ever just a single tweet from a single person. Basically every single time lots and lots of people come forward to say that it matches a pattern of behavior and to corroborate accounts. This hand wringing some people seem compelled toward makes genuinely no sense whatsoever. If you're an innocent person, you won't have a pattern of guilty behavior for tons of people to point to and say "look at this shit," so you don't have to imagine how you would react to such an event. It's not going to happen to you. So why worry?

It's a bizarre impulse to shift the topic to yourself and focus on your own imagined victimization instead of the actual victims on record.
What?!

You do realize there's a fuckton of innocent people currently incarcerated in the US? Estimations from 2014 range from 100.000 to 140.000. Let's not pretend the finger is never pointed towards innocents and that just by upholding the naive belief of "oh my friends will have my back" that everything will be alright.

This is not a defence for this Alexis Kennedy person btw (no idea who they are even) but simply to call out an incredibly bizarre and naive post.
 

grunkleFungus

Banned
Aug 22, 2018
171
NC, US
False rape accusations aren't very common at all. Yeah, sure, "but my friend...." but, in a lot of those cases I hear about there's more to it than that, if that friend even exists and isn't just some made up rhetorical device. If you want to be careful, Trust but Verify is what I adhere to. Multiple accusations from multiple people with consistent detail is good evidence. As I've said before, it's hard to get people to agree on lunch, much less agree on how the accused operates, manipulates, and abuses.

Another thing to consider is slippage. Sometimes, abusive people let slip what they do or how they do it. Take R. Kelly and his song "Marry the Pussy".
If I'm ever in the mood for two pussies
Then the pussy will bring another pussy to me
Along with the accusations we know of, this is very telling of how he thinks of women/girls and the way he commits his crimes. It's worth it to look back over statements that seemed just a little odd at the time to see if it lines up with accusations. And most of y'all are assuming rape gets prosecuted easily when the most successful cases have eyewitnesses like Emily Doe's case or many, many victims, like Larry Nasser or Jerry Sandusky. Also assuming that everyone believes rape victims, which is still definitely not the case!
 

stupei

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,801
What?!

You do realize there's a fuckton of innocent people currently incarcerated in the US? Estimations from 2014 range from 100.000 to 140.000. Let's not pretend the finger is never pointed towards innocents and that just by upholding the naive belief of "oh my friends will have my back" that everything will be alright.

This is not a defence for this Alexis Kennedy person btw (no idea who they are even) but simply to call out an incredibly bizarre and naive post.

This post is a joke and I imagine you know that.

Innocent people are incarcerated all the time, but the burden of proof placed on a case for sexual assault -- or in this case accusations of coercion and abuse of power that would never, ever result in arrest or incarceration -- that took place years ago is so high that it isn't the case. Stop trying to compare cases of police deliberately or carelessly arresting the wrong person and targeted arrests against minorities to a twitter thread.

I can't believe you could make a post like this and then call someone else naive.
 

YellowMustard

Banned
Jul 2, 2019
28
User Banned (Permanent): Misogynistic trolling.
I swear, you can't even hit on woman these days without being called the next ted bundy.
 

Mr Delabee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,163
UK
I legitimately don't understand why people think it's a good idea to post things like this, not only in general but in a thread like this specifically. What's the point?

Because there's a bunch of twats out there who think it's edgy and funny. They usually follow it up with the classic Oh CaN't YoU tAkE a JoKe?

As someone said above they wouldn't dare post it from their actual main account, god forbid they are outed as a shitty person whilst pretending otherwise.
 

Deleted member 3812

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,821
It's great to see these disgusting people getting outed in all entertainment industries. Hope this sparks more outings of people who shouldn't have a job at all within the video game industry.

WTF is up with all the fucked up/disgusting takes/drive-by shitposts in this thread and similar threads here on ERA???
 

Blackthorn

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,315
London
It's great to see these disgusting people getting outed in all entertainment industries. Hope this sparks more outings of people who shouldn't have a job at all within the video game industry.

WTF is up with all the fucked up/disgusting takes/drive-by shitposts in this thread and similar threads here on ERA???
They're really showing their ass in this thread too because:
  1. This isn't a criminal case and likely won't ever be, yet they keep bringing up court proceedings and "innocent until proven guilty".
  2. This is a UK issue yet they keep bringing up US statistics.
  3. This isn't a rape case (AFAIK) yet they keep bringing up the dangers of false rape allegations.
  4. There are multiple noteworthy people backing up the claims, including people in the company he was once the CEO of, yet they are treating it as "he-say, she-say".
It's clear they don't actually know what's going on and just see "man accused" and bring out their usual bag of tired talking points to attempt to minimise the issue and derail the thread. It's pitifully transparent.
 

Deleted member 3812

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,821
Well, the garbage has been removed, just reported YellowMustard and now poster is permanently banned from ERA.
 

AuraVanguard

Banned
Aug 28, 2019
2
User Banned (permanent): Troll account
I can't fucking stand all these sexual predators preying on people in the games industry. They're all fucking scum.

If I had it my way, this Alexis Kennedy guy would have his life destroyed. I'd want him beaten within an inch of his life. I'd have him hacking up blood and bile while he thinks about what he's done to women in the games industry. I'd start ripping out his toenails really slowly, hearing him beg for forgiveness and mercy. I'd flay that bastard open like the worthless sack of meat he is, taking my time to make sure he feels every single second of his punishment. Finally, I'd cut him down limb by limb, one layer of flesh, muscle, and bone at a time. I'd let his victims join in to hopefully get them som ioda if relief. It wouldn't be much, but it's what this goddamn monster deserves.
 

kvetcha

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,835
I can't fucking stand all these sexual predators preying on people in the games industry. They're all fucking scum.

If I had it my way, this Alexis Kennedy guy would have his life destroyed. I'd want him beaten within an inch of his life. I'd have him hacking up blood and bile while he thinks about what he's done to women in the games industry. I'd start ripping out his toenails really slowly, hearing him beg for forgiveness and mercy. I'd flay that bastard open like the worthless sack of meat he is, taking my time to make sure he feels every single second of his punishment. Finally, I'd cut him down limb by limb, one layer of flesh, muscle, and bone at a time. I'd let his victims join in to hopefully get them som ioda if relief. It wouldn't be much, but it's what this goddamn monster deserves.

This feels unnecessary.
 

jaekeem

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,743
I can't fucking stand all these sexual predators preying on people in the games industry. They're all fucking scum.

If I had it my way, this Alexis Kennedy guy would have his life destroyed. I'd want him beaten within an inch of his life. I'd have him hacking up blood and bile while he thinks about what he's done to women in the games industry. I'd start ripping out his toenails really slowly, hearing him beg for forgiveness and mercy. I'd flay that bastard open like the worthless sack of meat he is, taking my time to make sure he feels every single second of his punishment. Finally, I'd cut him down limb by limb, one layer of flesh, muscle, and bone at a time. I'd let his victims join in to hopefully get them som ioda if relief. It wouldn't be much, but it's what this goddamn monster deserves.

he's a terrible person and deserves everything coming his way, but what you posted is honestly fucking terrifying and bizarre
 

rras1994

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,742
I can't fucking stand all these sexual predators preying on people in the games industry. They're all fucking scum.

If I had it my way, this Alexis Kennedy guy would have his life destroyed. I'd want him beaten within an inch of his life. I'd have him hacking up blood and bile while he thinks about what he's done to women in the games industry. I'd start ripping out his toenails really slowly, hearing him beg for forgiveness and mercy. I'd flay that bastard open like the worthless sack of meat he is, taking my time to make sure he feels every single second of his punishment. Finally, I'd cut him down limb by limb, one layer of flesh, muscle, and bone at a time. I'd let his victims join in to hopefully get them som ioda if relief. It wouldn't be much, but it's what this goddamn monster deserves.
No. This attitude does not help victims, it focuses on your feelings and over rides theirs. Don't do this.
 
Dec 24, 2017
2,399
I can't fucking stand all these sexual predators preying on people in the games industry. They're all fucking scum.

If I had it my way, this Alexis Kennedy guy would have his life destroyed. I'd want him beaten within an inch of his life. I'd have him hacking up blood and bile while he thinks about what he's done to women in the games industry. I'd start ripping out his toenails really slowly, hearing him beg for forgiveness and mercy. I'd flay that bastard open like the worthless sack of meat he is, taking my time to make sure he feels every single second of his punishment. Finally, I'd cut him down limb by limb, one layer of flesh, muscle, and bone at a time. I'd let his victims join in to hopefully get them som ioda if relief. It wouldn't be much, but it's what this goddamn monster deserves.

Having once acted out revenge, as a reaction to my mother being hit by a stranger, when I was much younger, it really doesn't actually feel like anything has been resolved. I think the core of the matter is that we have these feelings, like you are having, because we feel like they will return power to those it was taken away from. It's really on the person who was directly aggrieved that can put the matter to rest, for themselves. The rest of us on the periphery, just have to learn how to process it more constructively.

I was lucky not to go to jail and have a semi-productive life ruined because of a emotionally driving absence of judgment.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,060
I can't fucking stand all these sexual predators preying on people in the games industry. They're all fucking scum.

If I had it my way, this Alexis Kennedy guy would have his life destroyed. I'd want him beaten within an inch of his life. I'd have him hacking up blood and bile while he thinks about what he's done to women in the games industry. I'd start ripping out his toenails really slowly, hearing him beg for forgiveness and mercy. I'd flay that bastard open like the worthless sack of meat he is, taking my time to make sure he feels every single second of his punishment. Finally, I'd cut him down limb by limb, one layer of flesh, muscle, and bone at a time. I'd let his victims join in to hopefully get them som ioda if relief. It wouldn't be much, but it's what this goddamn monster deserves.
Jesus christ. This is disgusting and wrong.
 

Just_a_Mouse

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,030
I can't fucking stand all these sexual predators preying on people in the games industry. They're all fucking scum.

If I had it my way, this Alexis Kennedy guy would have his life destroyed. I'd want him beaten within an inch of his life. I'd have him hacking up blood and bile while he thinks about what he's done to women in the games industry. I'd start ripping out his toenails really slowly, hearing him beg for forgiveness and mercy. I'd flay that bastard open like the worthless sack of meat he is, taking my time to make sure he feels every single second of his punishment. Finally, I'd cut him down limb by limb, one layer of flesh, muscle, and bone at a time. I'd let his victims join in to hopefully get them som ioda if relief. It wouldn't be much, but it's what this goddamn monster deserves.

We don't need to be doing this. Expose them and let justice take care the rest, as hard as that is to believe in at times. They can't hide anymore.
 

plagiarize

Eating crackers
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
27,508
Cape Cod, MA
I never understand this kind of fear mongering. It's entirely irrational.

If you were accused of doing something that is entirely out of character, that you would never do, then there's no reason to respond in a guilty manner. Presumably you have met people in your lifetime who would defend you if you were accused of behavior that is completely out of character and not, as is the case here, instead have many, many people come forward to say, actually, not only is this completely in character, but they know of other instances of it happening and have heard of it for many years.

This isn't ever just a single tweet from a single person. Basically every single time lots and lots of people come forward to say that it matches a pattern of behavior and to corroborate accounts. This hand wringing some people seem compelled toward makes genuinely no sense whatsoever. If you're an innocent person, you won't have a pattern of guilty behavior for tons of people to point to and say "look at this shit," so you don't have to imagine how you would react to such an event. It's not going to happen to you. So why worry?

It's a bizarre impulse to shift the topic to yourself and focus on your own imagined victimization instead of the actual victims on record.
Agreed.

Look, I get that it generally comes from the mindset of 'Well, I'm NOT guilty of this stuff, so when I put myself in this situation mentally I'm going to imagine what it's like to be accused of this stuff I'd never do' which isn't entirely terrible, because if someone can't imagine what it's like to be predatory there's some positives to take from it.

But, you just aren't going to find a disparate group of accusers suddenly forwards as we've seen in this case and I don't know why other people can't see that. Do we occasionally see one person make a false accusation? Sure. It happens. But you don't see multiple people coming forwards talking about it, with multiple other people confirming that it's an open secret etc etc.

I've heard of some of the people coming forwards. I hadn't heard of Alexis Kennedy. I'm not sure what Rhianna Pratchett would stand to gain by lying here. It's extremely illogical to presume Kennedy is the victim of conspiracy and multiple false charges.
 

stupei

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,801
Such an awesome and excellent response to the victims who are coming out to speak out against Kennedy. This is the type of official response that should be released.

Obviously the biggest concern here is the victims but as someone who very eagerly backed the Sunless Skies kickstarter and really really enjoys their work, I felt pretty awful about this revelation especially. Seeing many of his victims come out now to say that the current team at Failbetter has been nothing but supportive and did everything they could to sever all financial ties years ago is genuinely reassuring and relieves at least some of the queasy feeling I've had since reading the news.