Bernie didn't run against the anointed one.That's bizarre because they're politically aligned.
I've only seen that attitude on this website to be honest though.
Bernie didn't run against the anointed one.That's bizarre because they're politically aligned.
I've only seen that attitude on this website to be honest though.
bUt ShE wOnT mAkE a DiFfErEnCe
I think Bernie's whole appeal, at least to me and my leftist friends, is that we ARE the running mate. His slogan is "Not me. Us.", and it really does feel like a grass-roots attempt at mounting a revolution and getting unenthused and unengaged people involved.
It has to be Bernie Sanders. The false equivalence between Warren and Sanders needs to stop. They do have many areas of overlap, but the simple matter is Sanders has a more progressive record and platform. That's it.
It may seem strange, but there are plenty of people (even on Era) who like AOC and hate Sanders.
Mhm. Hell, there are literally people who loved AOC but suddenly got incredibly sour on her the moment it was announced she'd endorse him. Like "I'm going to refuse to vote for her" sour. It's wild.
It's people whose knowledge of intersectional theory begins and ends with "This person is a minority AND a woman, how quaint."That's bizarre because they're politically aligned.
I've only seen that attitude on this website to be honest though.
That's bizarre because they're politically aligned.
I've only seen that attitude on this website to be honest though.
Yes, it's pretty frustrating that the two are treated as inter-changeable.
Obviously I support both, and either would make a fantastic president that's fighting for worthy causes. But to me Warren is the consensus choice. I see a lot of powerful interests who would prefer 4 more years of Trump than a Sanders Presidency - some of them are within the Democratic party. So Bernie's campaign has a much bigger challenge. While Warren doesn't seem to be facing the same disdain outside of twitter & social media bubbles.
The thing that's a huge difference between the two candidates, is their Global Agenda. Warren seems to be lacking one - while Bernie even in 2016 outlined his priority. When he was on the debate stage and every other candidate named: Russia... Iran... Nuclear Weapons... ISIS... China. Bernie got on the stage and said "global crisis of climate change". Low and behold we are nearly 4 years into a President with a priority to accelerate the crisis, no global leadership on the issue, and incremental changes in behavior which have no way of stopping the oncoming storm. People are dying World wide every year and the numbers will grow exponentially. Hurricane Florence has caused damages valued at around $17bn and over 50 deaths. There are huge multi-million cities with a perspective of no water next summer. And scientists say that their estimates regarding how quickly this will escalate have been optimistic compared to what they are actually seeing in a short frame of time. It's something I argued over during the last primary - Clinton might have been president but she would not have done enough to avert a global catastrophic because she was deeply entrenched in the system, Warren is entrenched but less.. so. I'm sure she'd act boldly when called upon but it's not her priority the same way it's for Sanders. There is other things but this for me is the TOP priority - a Global Vision for a Future which is not Dystopian Nightmare and doesn't make films about Mad Max a documentary.
What has Warren said about the Bolivian coup? I think the signaling, especially on foreign policy matters; and Warren's record voting for the military budget increases, and talking about making a "green armed forces", that matters too. The solidarity Bernie gets from other leftists around the world is important to me as well. It is significant, for example that Lula endorsed Bernie.Bernie's right, we truly are stronger together.
imo when they've voted together 95% of time since they've been together in congress, it kind of sounds like they overlap in most areas tbh.
Wow. Interesting I would love to hear more as I'm not an American so it's just so weird for me to see this behaviour from the outside. To me sometimes it seems like certain liberals get more riled by Bernie and European style social democracy than republicans do.it's definitely not just on Era unfortunately
I could probably write a dissertation on why Bernie is so singularly reviled by a vocal contingent of liberals, but the short version is that pretty much everything about his appeal and success as a national political figure plays against the flaws and contradictions in how liberals have constructed their political identities. AOC, despite being ideologically similar, doesn't expose those contradictions to the same degree, in large part because she's a young Latina and because she engages in the sort of "I'm one of you" cultural signaling to Democrats that Bernie never would
Some of his earliest events from this year have been in the south. I think for sure the strategy is very different.tbh while i recognize we live in this grotesque timeline where iowa and new hampshire are the most important places in the universe and so they objectively have to put a lot of focus there if they want to win, i'd love to see some of this energy from his campaign in the south. it was a big misstep for him in 2016, and he's had a lot of growth in terms of changing his approach and reworking his campaign this go around, so i'm hopeful he will.
Wow. Interesting I would love to hear more as I'm not an American so it's just so weird for me to see this behaviour from the outside. To me sometimes it seems like certain liberals get more riled by Bernie and European style social democracy than republicans do.
What has Warren said about the Bolivian coup? I think the signaling, especially on foreign policy matters; and Warren's record voting for the military budget increases, and talking about making a "green armed forces", that matters too. The solidarity Bernie gets from other leftists around the world is important to me as well. It is significant, for example that Lula endorsed Bernie.
admittedly i do have a certain level of skepticism because i lived through the 2008 primary where One Candidate was praised as being The Great Peace Bringer, while The Other was decried as an evil War Hawk Out To Destroy All Brown People, and we all know how that story played out
I basically don't think we can do better than Bernie on foreign policy in this country. He really is a once in a lifetime candidate if that's the issue you care most about (it increasingly is becoming that way for me); and as you say, even then it's not like perfect. But like you can go on YouTube and watch Bernie talk about Allende and other Latin American countries where the US backed fascists to replace democratically elected leaders. And the NYtime published a "hit-piece" about protests he attended in Nicaragua while the US was giving aid to death squads. Meanwhile Warren was a republican at the time voting for people who supported these policies. I don't understand how people don't see the difference between him and Warren, frankly.i'm sure we'll eventually get a "wow that's bad" tweet from her, and that'll do just as much to help the people of bolivia as sanders's did (which is to say: not all that much!)
(i personally find bernie's commitment to anti-imperialism somewhat questionable because he's still an american, running for president, and americans love to lick boot, but also because he called literal war criminal joe biden a close friend during the previous debate... and then brought up that joe biden was a war criminal like twenty minutes later. he also gave that weird boot licker defense of g*bbard during that dust up a few weeks ago, and it's like, my dude, is that really the best rhetoric to defend her with? this is all on top of him pushing for the government to build useless military toys in vermont because Jobs.)
(admittedly i do have a certain level of skepticism because i lived through the 2008 primary where One Candidate was praised as being The Great Peace Bringer, while The Other was decried as an evil War Hawk Out To Destroy All Brown People, and we all know how that story played out)
all that being said, Sanders is, of course, a step in the right direction for america (or should i say... left direction) and you should vote for him.
Neither are the resetera posters that think they are, hence why it's a match made in heaven.
AOC was too young to run against her Abuela. That's why you see some people who love her and hate Bernie.That's bizarre because they're politically aligned.
I've only seen that attitude on this website to be honest though.
(sigh) Bernie and Warren are just going to knock each other out of the race, at this point. It's infuriating.
I don't care who gets it. But this split down the line thing is a curse.
this is not true at all.she is probably disliked nationally more than she is liked anyways.
I voted no because the fact is, he had a heart attack.
Obama could back him and it won't change anything.
AOC was too young to run against her Abuela. That's why you see some people who love her and hate Bernie.
It's intentional. They want to apply "progressive" to any candidate to the point that it becomes meaningless so that calling Bernie the most progressive candidate means nothing.I recall a bunch of posters telling me how Kamala was just as progressive as Bernie because she supported his Medicare for all plan! Except... she kept walking back on it. That's basically all these candidates in a nutshell. None of them are credibly as good as Bernie on issues I care most about, and the constant need to lie to people about this seems wrong.
American (neo-)liberalism in a political sense can be summarised as:Wow. Interesting I would love to hear more as I'm not an American so it's just so weird for me to see this behaviour from the outside. To me sometimes it seems like certain liberals get more riled by Bernie and European style social democracy than republicans do.
I've never seen such heaping evidence that this word just means literally whatever the user wants it to meanAmerican (neo-)liberalism in a political sense can be summarised as:
Complicated Policy = Good Policy
The truth is always in the middle so yo must always compromise
Market and corporate freedom IS democracy
'Class' is an individuals least important cultural signifier
Sanders isn't (as) liberal so when he says 'Americans deserve to be able to walk into a doctors office and be checked out for free' he's causing extreme cognitive - dissonance in the people who see his contrasting political plans as an attack on their morals.
Its very similar to how non-vegans react when they're told that eating meat is bad for the environment.
I imagine voting will go down (varying per state, of course) like this:Why couldn't one candidate's support move to the other's when it's clear one of them isn't able to continue? Doesn't have to mean their split will allow Biden or Buttigieg to win.
Idk about the rest, but the market and corporate freedom part being democracy seems close enough to an actual definition.I've never seen such heaping evidence that this word just means literally whatever the user wants it to mean
American (neo-)liberalism in a political sense can be summarised as:
Complicated Policy = Good Policy
The truth is always in the middle so yo must always compromise
Market and corporate freedom IS democracy
'Class' is an individuals least important cultural signifier
Sanders isn't (as) liberal so when he says 'Americans deserve to be able to walk into a doctors office and be checked out for free' he's causing extreme cognitive - dissonance in the people who see his contrasting political plans as an attack on their morals.
Its very similar to how non-vegans react when they're told that eating meat is bad for the environment.
this is mostly accurate, but another part of it (among others) is that many liberals have formulated their identities around the idea that loyalty to the Democratic Party and to specific personalities within it (HRC, Pelosi, Obama, etc.) is a sufficient proxy for being a "good, progressive person," which means that the suggestion that those things are not in fact sufficient is experienced as a personal attack on their character; as I alluded to above, a major reason why AOC doesn't seem to trigger this response nearly as much is because she engages in a lot of in-group cultural signaling aimed at this specific sort of liberal
Yeah, I'm not sure how exactly she'll help grow his appeal. AOC isn't getting me on board with Bernie.Skeptics of Bernie will stay skeptical of his win down to Bernie having an electoral lead over Trump in the GE.
AOC was too young to run against her Abuela. That's why you see some people who love her and hate Bernie.
Yeah, I'm not sure how exactly she'll help grow his appeal. AOC isn't getting me on board with Bernie.
Maybe if (won't happen) it was Obama doing this for Bernie, I'd maybe be less opposed and begin to think he could meaningfully grow his base.
There were so many arguments about it in the primary thread. I remember people were arguing about Beto being progressive or not right before someone posted a tweet with him refusing to call himself progressive. It was hilariousI recall a bunch of posters telling me how Kamala was just as progressive as Bernie because she supported his Medicare for all plan! Except... she kept walking back on it. That's basically all these candidates in a nutshell. None of them are credibly as good as Bernie on issues I care most about, and the constant need to lie to people about this seems wrong.
It's intentional. They want to apply "progressive" to any candidate to the point that it becomes meaningless so that calling Bernie the most progressive candidate means nothing.
Not sure what you mean. Why would the endorsement and campaigning by the former President who I align with very closely politically (and generally really like), not significantly influence who I'd support in a primary?what is it about Obama that is special for you? Enough to get you "on board" with Bernie of all people.
Not sure what you mean. Why would the endorsement and campaigning by the former President who I align with very closely politically (and generally really like), not significantly influence who I'd support in a primary?
That is indeed a fact, and I must be one of the few people who, the more I thought about that fact, the more I went from Warrenflexible to Bernie curious to a straight up 3 on the Warren-Bernie Kinsey scale.
Somehow, in one fell swoop, Bernie suffering from a heart attack brought to light two things: on one hand, how urgent it is to fight for the change we need, for which Bernie is a singular vessel; on the other, how what Bernie represents is bigger than him. Every single candidate is human, vulnerable to whatever life brings, mortal; if anything, though, the fear of uncertainty attached to that is less acute in Bernie's case for me, because his election would represent something important in and of itself.
Also...fact is, it's not all that uncommon for presidents/presidential candidates to have to struggle through health issues
Nope - Beto was my candidate.oh ok, so Biden for now until otherwise? Just wasn't sure what you meant. Sounds good.