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Alec Holowka (Night in the Woods, TowerFall) accused of sexual assault [Update: Alec Holowka has reportedly passed away] [See staff posts/threadmarks]
- Thread starter TacomaSCDisaster
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My condoleances. Stay healthy and safe; that's my wish to everyone involved with this tragedy.
I'm in agreeance. Especially with the bolded. These discussions are looking more and more like TMZ for gaming subculture nerds every day, complete with snarky, empty takes and a hatefully unhealthy dose of cancel culture. It's where a very large portion of this community's toxicity is brewed and short of a moderational reckoning, I think one final "cancel" is in order.
How can we make the line between internet voyeurism and activism distinct when vital complainants of movements are embedded in that culture. This is not and should be limited to Era. Quinn's activism lives on the internet and uses it as a vehicle to expand the message in a necessary way.
This is the best post in this thread. Everyone should give this a read.
it is, but it's sadder that society's lack of protection and awareness of abuse led to this for both abusers and abused.
Banning discussions on accusations of abuse is the opposite of helpful. It's forcing victims back into the shadows.
I am inclined to agree.
Victims need support. The law needs to investigate all allegations thoroughly.
Due process is also needed for those accused.
We cannot descend into a carnival of horror for all parties.
I'm actually surprised not a lot more people commit suicide too after having the entire internet come after them (especially if these people are already suffering from mental illness).
Now Zoe is going to face the same shit too which is ironic considering people are attacking her for pressuring someone into suicide which is exactly what they're doing now to her.
Awful situation all around when you consider he was a victim of abuse as well. And yeah don't read the comments on that tweet since both sides are acting like dicks as expected.
Now Zoe is going to face the same shit too which is ironic considering people are attacking her for pressuring someone into suicide which is exactly what they're doing now to her.
Awful situation all around when you consider he was a victim of abuse as well. And yeah don't read the comments on that tweet since both sides are acting like dicks as expected.
Lots of gasoline for internet hate mobs this week. I think our society would benefit by eliminating statute of limitations on sexual assault as well as expanding remedies for civil suits stemming from sexual assault. That makes reporting these crimes to authorities a viable option. That way the arbiter of these difficult situations will be an expert or a dedicated group of peers dedicated to sifting through the rubble. As it stands, we're just a bunch of mildly-informed morons making judgment calls (which, not coincidentally, happen to match our pre-conceived notions) and acting accordingly.
It's not productive to use social media to direct internet hate mobs against our perceived enemies.
It's not productive to use social media to direct internet hate mobs against our perceived enemies.
Agreed.
I think above all else, his death is a tragedy. That doesn't mean he shouldn't have been called out. That doesn't mean more voices shouldn't have chimed in with corroborating stories. I don't know his personal financial situation, but I don't believe he became literally unemployable with this news. It was too soon for a redemption arc, but it could have happened. This clearly wasn't a healthy man pushed to suicide by internet bullies. I didn't see any prominent voices pushing for harrassment targeted at him. Maybe they could have done a better job of encouraging people not to target him personally. But who knows if that would have done anything.
Ultimately, he felt the consequences of his actions were too much to bare. If he was innocent in this I believe someone would have spoken up for him, and the idea that the indie game community is somehow bewitched by feminist obligation and willing to just lie and pile on is ludicrous. There's a lot to learn here though.
This is correct (deleted/deactivated and not privated).
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Go read the first few pages of this thread and let me know what healthy discussion it promotes.
Theres nothing wrong with outing abusers and forcing them from the industry. People shouldn't have to work with toxic people. People also shouldn't have to forgive abuse.
Problem is of course, Alec was a game Dev, and I'm assuming he saw his future and his life was over. And forgiveness is not something his victims should just hand out cause he asks.
Honestly I dunno what the answer is. I don't think there can be one.
gg can go to hell though.
Problem is of course, Alec was a game Dev, and I'm assuming he saw his future and his life was over. And forgiveness is not something his victims should just hand out cause he asks.
Honestly I dunno what the answer is. I don't think there can be one.
gg can go to hell though.
No, it isn't. Read these two posts:
Which would show their hypocrisy since the channers usually cheer for driving people to suicide. Not that I expect any consistent logic from that scum.
The ban should be on kneejerk reactions to things, not on discussing accusations period.
banning discussion of anything that's not directly related to games is kind of myopic and seems not dissimilar to That Place sequestering "politics" as its entire own board separate from off-topic
not knowing that someone is an abuser, a gator, a homophobe, whatever doesn't make them... stop being that?
not knowing that someone is an abuser, a gator, a homophobe, whatever doesn't make them... stop being that?
I agree with you, but there is no due process. The courts are empty, or stacked not due to corruption necessarily but the same old biases against abuse victims that have always been.
The internet was started to form communities in virtual space, but we're alone. We're all alone.
Seriously. It was made public. It absolutely needs to be discussed.
What some people seem to be proposing with regards to banning these sorts of discussions here is akin to the "keep politics out of my video games!" we've all heard uttered from the darkest basements.
Victims should not be silenced here or anywhere.
While I generally agree, 'internet mob justice' rarely brings about the change that's actually needed.
It only tends the make matters worse. It encourages violent rhetoric against not only the abuser, but also the abused. The 'mob' splintering off into groups who start to attack each other and those involved, each group trying to one up each other and 'win'.
This entire thread has been based on kneejerk reactions. That is all these threads are. There has to be another way for victims to go about it, other than trial by social media, because it helps no one in the long run.
The guy had mental health issues and reading between the lines it sounds like he was struggling to make sense of his actions in any case. The problem with the Internet is that even if somehow Alex and Zoe had worked through their issues outside of social media, there'd still be wankers out there giving them shit. It's just not the place for issue resolution. People can fuck up really badly in life and turn it around. But not under the glare of social media.
What a load of complete bs.
1. The "chain of events" you speak of certainly didn't start with Zoe going public with the accusations.
2. Threatening self-harm is a common psychological tactic for abusers to silence their victims and to control them. Victims should never be given the feeling that they cannot speak up.
OOF
I'm worried about Scott and Bethany. They were already heartbroken about the whole thing, now this happens.
I'm worried about Scott and Bethany. They were already heartbroken about the whole thing, now this happens.
Why am I not surprised the lions' share of tut-tutting about internet mobs comes from folks who were MIA when the initial allegations broke?
We are not the court of public opinion. We're a forum. Acting like posts in this thread drove Alec to suicide is a woeful misrepresentation of what happened.
Again, we cannot simply go "nope, don't talk about accusations" because the industry tried that for 30+ years and it clearly was not working.
Even right now, people are jumping to conclusions and kneejerking about things. There is a way to discuss these kinds of topics without instantly resorting to this kind of behavior, and that's the kind of thing that needs to be corrected.
I never thought I'd see people against the #metoo movement, but here we are.
The whole point is that there is not another way.
But what? The legal system that has no way to account for crimes in a space without blood? The muddiness of allowing the abuser and the abused to be pushed into a forced unwanted group therapy i.e. both continuing on as if nothing happened and trying to work together? The unions that frankly are still years off if they happen at all under the weight of a system that loves disposable wage slaves?
I just don't think public scrutiny should be disposed of entirely.
Yep, this. Many posts in here read like they're trying to sweep cases of abuse under the rug. It's all very transparent and quite disgusting.
Like what? Social media is the best way currently for victims to get their voice heard.
It's always state a problem and then not offer a solution...
In some way this feels like a failure of the system. Social, legal, or whatever. Like it's kinda designed (or allowed) to protect "damage," and all sorts of fucked up shit happens because we don't have anything in place to counteract it, like corrupted seeds growing in a garden. People abused. People dying. Floundering in an ocean of communal suffering and crying out.
What are we going to do?
What are we going to do?
Exactly. Our society lets these things happen, lets abuse fester beneath the surface unchallenged and unremedied until the dam bursts and then the multitude of the abuse is thrust into our view. Then in an attempt to assuage guilt for having let this situation exist for so long, society then takes the most destructive approach to the few instances it has unwillingly acknowledged as if that wipes everyone's hands clean of the culpability.
I'm not going to pretend that I can comprehend what Zoe went through before she made this public, what Alec went through and now what Zoe and Alec's family are going through after this most tragic of updates. All I can do is give my condolences to all involved. It's a terrible situation that leaves many people scarred for life. I'm particularly upset for Zoe, considering what she has already been through. I can't bring myself to read about this situation beyond this site however, considering the vile things people are alluding to that are being said about Zoe.
Absolutely. The last few pages are not only naive but exactly why victims don't speak up.
I actually feel like crying right now. There are so many post here that are basically we should silence victims because think about what affcet it will have on the abuser. Why does no one care about the affects on the victim of being shut up or the abuse they receive or the very abuse thta made them victims in the first place? This is just so shitty.
I'm absolutely not against it, if anything, I want better for the victims because going this route is not helping anyone. Has this situation helped Zoe? Absolutely not, this is the worst way it could have gone. Stop trying to misconstrude my words.
User Banned (2 weeks): inappropriate speculation on mental health in a sensitive thread
This could have very well happened you nor
I have the answers to this.
I hope the victims his family and friends can all get through this tough situation.
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