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Deleted member 6056

Oct 25, 2017
7,240
Not realistic. Especially that house
Not realistic with that size house at all. Unless in an episode it came out he inherited it or something theres no way even with 80s inflation being less than it is in 2020.

TdvdcLqZz8fzx-o4a7q_5cI-hf1S4bIbyF-Bnlaim_w.jpg


Just did the math and before taxes, Homer makes $24,523.20 a year. It is literally impossible for him to afford a house + utilities + groceries + other expenses with that, but I guess we're not supposed to question it...

Uh...I work in a power plant and this paycheck makes zero kinds of fucking sense to me. His net pay is $362.19 for 40 hours? Dude...I dont care what your union dues, and pre and post taxes and savings allotments are. Thats like $9 to $12 an hour kinda bullshit. Power Plant guys Intern at $20 an hour and can make as a control room attendant up around $50 per hour after years for seniority. Plus where its a swing shift job theres differential premium on the hour and often with sunday incentives. How it was at Dow, Aep, FE and Dominion from my experience and conversations with their folks too. Homer's the safety attentdant which means he's a dayshift only guy though so he's on straight pay unless he needs to prep or attend outage work in the evenings or something. Though how a control room guy is also head of Safety is beyond me because you can't have a floor position for a guy required to sit and monitor all day unless he's sharing the role in shifts with spare personnel.

The only explanation for this is Homer is so BAD with money that Marge made him put all but his money into savings accounts as wireless deposits on his checks and only allows him the basics for his checking. Which honestly would be smart and the only way to survive Homer's bullshit otherwise hed blow it all. His take home would normally be with all his years, even at a shitty play , somewhere in the low to mid $30''s and hour so something like $1000 to $1400 gross per week.
 
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Deleted member 1659

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,191
Maybe I'm aging myself but a lot of you guys are overlooking how much more affordable it was for working class families in the 80's to not live in destitution.

My mom worked in an autoplant and my dad was a cab driver in the mid 80's and they bought their first house in TORONTO in 1991 for around $100K which even when adjusted for inflation would be $250K in 2020 dollars.
 

Gaia Lanzer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,669
John Hughes was a rich white suburban kid so all his protagonists are rich white suburban kids. (Some of the kids in Breakfast Club are not rich I guess)
Also, Molly Ringwald's character from "Pretty In Pink" was from the poorer area of town, as were Eric Stoltz and Mary Stuart Masteron's characters in "Some Kind of Wonderful", but both those ones are literal opposites of each other (poor girl falling in love with rich guy/poor guy falling in love with rich girl) and he still sneaks in the whole "rich people" theme into them.
 

lunarworks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,116
Toronto
Maybe I'm aging myself but a lot of you guys are overlooking how much more affordable it was for working class families in the 80's to not live in destitution.

My mom worked in an autoplant and my dad was a cab driver in the mid 80's and they bought their first house in TORONTO in 1991 for around $100K which even when adjusted for inflation would be $250K in 2020 dollars.
My parents bought my childhood home in Oakville for $80,000 in the late '70s. They sold it 20ish years later for $500,000. Last time I checked, it sold again about 5 years ago for $1,500,000.

Real estate has gone bonkers.
 

Wag

Member
Nov 3, 2017
11,638
Maybe?

In 1975 my Mom got our 4 bedroom 1 bath row home in Middle Class Philly for like 20k. The mortgage was like $90 a month on a 30 va loan.
I'm being generous if I say Al made $4hr back in '85, and even then with a family of 4 it seems kind of hard to think he wasn't living paycheck to paycheck (even for one person making minimum). How did he save up enough money to buy a house?
 

Deleted member 46493

User requested account closure
Banned
Aug 7, 2018
5,231
Maybe I'm aging myself but a lot of you guys are overlooking how much more affordable it was for working class families in the 80's to not live in destitution.
This basically sums up the whole thread. People don't know how much cheaper rent and homes used to be. I have some older friends who rented in nice areas of Manhattan in the 90s for less than $1k/mo (in today's money). Now it'd be $3k min for the same apartment.
 
Oct 28, 2017
27,069
I'm being generous if I say Al made $4hr back in '85, and even then with a family of 4 it seems kind of hard to think he wasn't living paycheck to paycheck (even for one person making minimum). How did he save up enough money to buy a house?


Real talk. We used to steal power straight from the wire when we were dirt poor. If Al Bundy was eating "toaster shakings" and selling shoes, he was getting some hookup shit too!


I always found it funny that Al wanted no parts of Peg despite the fact she was extremely hot. It didnt really hit me to the reruns when I was older in the 90s
 
OP
OP

HomokHarcos

Member
Jul 11, 2018
2,447
Canada
I guess the quote from the Mystery Science Theater 3000 theme sums it up. "Repeat yourself 'it's just a show. I should really just relax'"
 

Bakercat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,154
'merica
I noticed this alot with family sitcoms, parents work minimum wage jobs, or just one income, but they have a decent home, kids, dog, etc. Thought my family was doing it wrong and I was a failure.
 

MisterZimbu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
372
Just did the math and before taxes, Homer makes $24,523.20 a year. It is literally impossible for him to afford a house + utilities + groceries + other expenses with that, but I guess we're not supposed to question it...

To be fair, this episode is decades old at this point- money went a lot further back then. If we adjust for the increase in pay the middle class has earned since then he's earning a much more respectable $24,527.60 a year.
 

AlwaysSalty

The Fallen
Nov 12, 2017
1,442
Don't worry guys, with all the damage done to the economy and the rampant acceleration ala Trumponomics we'll be back to the good old days after the housing market goes fucking nuclear in the next couple years. You'll probably be able to buy a house working full time at McDonald's.
 

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
Father of the Bride:
iu


These are goddamn mansions
That house is actually in the city next to the one where I grew up, and if I were to blinds guess its price today, I'd probably peg it somewhere between $2-3 million. That's a really nice neighborhood, though, and that particular house doesn't stand out along its neighbors.

Even back in those days, that would be an expensive house, but at the same time I don't think the family in that movie is supposed to be poor by any stretch.
 

data west

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,008
I feel like we have this talking point every couple of weeks

It's the new 'Is Die Hard a Christmas movie?'
 

Zorg1000

Banned
Jul 22, 2019
1,750
Sitcoms never accurately portray the lifestyle of low/medium income people.

Rich people have no clue how the real world works for most people.
 

Zoe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,236
Even back in those days, that would be an expensive house, but at the same time I don't think the family in that movie is supposed to be poor by any stretch.
When Steve Martin buys the house back from brownface Eugene Levy in the second movie, he is able to hand him a check for 100k on the spot.
 

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
When Steve Martin buys the house back from brownface Eugene Levy in the second movie, he is able to hand him a check for 100k on the spot.
Actually, yeah. Judging from my mom's house that she purchased around that time (93) and how much that cost, I would have guessed the back-then price of the FotB house was around $500k, so that would have been a solid 20% down.
 

Zoe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,236
Actually, yeah. Judging from my mom's house that she purchased around that time (93) and how much that cost, I would have guessed the back-then price of the FotB house was around $500k, so that would have been a solid 20% down.
Well that's just supposed to be Levy's profit on the sale. I can't recall if the actual sale price is stated earlier in the movie.
 

regenhuber

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,201
Some of you take this way too literally.

It's a sitcom where the house is the main stage. You need people on that stage and give them room to act.
That limits how small they could have made Al Bundy house.

Some of you also need to understand that back when the show was on, people didn't discuss shit like this online. Nobody cared and even if someone did, they couldn't make videos about on YouTube.
 

Jest

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,565
That's the weird thing is Marcy, their next door neighbor, is a manager for Kyoto National Bank and is from a family with money. And yet Al lives on the same street.

I don't recall if it's ever stated definitively when Marcy buys the house but the show starts with her and Steve being recently married so they may be newer to the neighborhood. Two wildly different household incomes existing on the same street isn't all that strange if the lower household income has owned the property for considerably longer.

There's plenty of people whose family bought houses when they cost 5 figures and have since had the property appreciate into much higher 6 figure values. As long as the family doesn't sell they can live there next to people paying considerably more simply for the cost of property tax.

Some of you take this way too literally.

It's a sitcom where the house is the main stage. You need people on that stage and give them room to act.
That limits how small they could have made Al Bundy house.

Some of you also need to understand that back when the show was on, people didn't discuss shit like this online. Nobody cared and even if someone did, they couldn't make videos about on YouTube.

regenhuber

It's not that anyone "needs to understand" the things you're pointing out. It's that the topic is essentially a thought experiment. There's really not much to discuss if you simply say, "It's a tv show, it's not that deep." So why not take the time to actually consider the logistics? There's certainly no harm in it.
 

Biggersmaller

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,966
Minneapolis
After I was born my parents bought a home in 1983 for ~$45k. It was in a "bad" Minneapolis neighborhood, but my dad worked at Burger King and my mom Dayton's (basically Macy's). By the 90s they found better work as working retail became impossible. Although still unrealistic, the working class sitcom family was not pure fantasy with the pilot in 1987, but by 1997 the middle class largely required a college degree office job.
 

lunarworks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,116
Toronto
I noticed this alot with family sitcoms, parents work minimum wage jobs, or just one income, but they have a decent home, kids, dog, etc. Thought my family was doing it wrong and I was a failure.
It's called "selling the American ideal", and it's been a thing since Leave It To Beaver. It didn't matter if it was grounded in reality, it was an expression of how things were supposed to be.
 

turtle553

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,219
If he bought the house around when Kelly was born, early 70s, it was before a really bad period of inflation in the country.

united-states-inflation-cpi.png


A fixed mortgage payment in 1970 would be really cheap in 1985 after inflation. It's one of the reasons boomers benefited so much from real estate they bought while young. Later on they could sell or take equity loans just because they had houses that went up in value so much. Minorities were typically locked out of many of these opportunities.
 

Jest

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,565
Jest

Just don't want the younger members to get the wrong ideas lol
The 90s weren't THAT great.

That's fair enough. I would hope that any younger members wouldn't walk away with the impression that things were nothing but wonderful but I don't think that's all that likely anyways as most of the shows discussed in this topic have been about families that are still plagued with debt and struggles. The Bundy's and The Connor's especially.

What I find interesting though is the fact that you can look at the question through today's lens and immediately it's obvious that there's no way it would be possible today but when viewed through the lens of the time period, it actually was possible. So it ends up just further highlighting how wide the gap between Minimum Wage and Cost of Living has become over a relatively short amount of time. "The Bundy's were poor as hell and were far from happy but they could afford a house on minimum wage."
 

oneils

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,084
Ottawa Canada
Not realistic with that size house at all. Unless in an episode it came out he inherited it or something theres no way even with 80s inflation being less than it is in 2020.



Uh...I work in a power plant and this paycheck makes zero kinds of fucking sense to me. His net pay is $362.19 for 40 hours? Dude...I dont care what your union dues, and pre and post taxes and savings allotments are. Thats like $9 to $12 an hour kinda bullshit. Power Plant guys Intern at $20 an hour and can make as a control room attendant up around $50 per hour after years for seniority. Plus where its a swing shift job theres differential premium on the hour and often with sunday incentives. How it was at Dow, Aep, FE and Dominion from my experience and conversations with their folks too. Homer's the safety attentdant which means he's a dayshift only guy though so he's on straight pay unless he needs to prep or attend outage work in the evenings or something. Though how a control room guy is also head of Safety is beyond me because you can't have a floor position for a guy required to sit and monitor all day unless he's sharing the role in shifts with spare personnel.

The only explanation for this is Homer is so BAD with money that Marge made him put all but his money into savings accounts as wireless deposits on his checks and only allows him the basics for his checking. Which honestly would be smart and the only way to survive Homer's bullshit otherwise hed blow it all. His take home would normally be with all his years, even at a shitty play , somewhere in the low to mid $30''s and hour so something like $1000 to $1400 gross per week.

The Simpsons started in 1989, 30 years ago. That picture is probably decades old. That's why the $amount probably doesn't make sense to you.
 

regenhuber

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,201
So it ends up just further highlighting how wide the gap between Minimum Wage and Cost of Living has become over a relatively short amount of time.

That is a great observation.
Especially when you factor in that AlBundy lived in Chicago.

But if we are playing this game, let me add this:
- I can't remember any episode where that family went on a vacation (think they visited the UK once but that was paid for iirc)
- Al drives a shitty, old car / Pam doesn't have one at all
- old ass furniture, cheapest food possible
- kids never get shit

Seems like the vast minority of their money goes toward maintaining that house.
 

Jest

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,565
That is a great observation.
Especially when you factor in that AlBundy lived in Chicago.

But if we are playing this game, let me add this:
- I can't remember any episode where that family went on a vacation (think they visited the UK once but that was paid for iirc)
- Al drives a shitty, old car / Pam doesn't have one at all
- old ass furniture, cheapest food possible
- kids never get shit

Seems like the vast minority of their money goes toward maintaining that house.

There's more factors when we start getting into the weeds that are the details. Peggy is stated to constantly squander away any money she gets her hands on (the Home Shopping Network is a constant) and both she and Al are known to frequent strip clubs. Poor judgement and decision making is a staple of the family as a whole (they frequently engage in scams and steal money from each other) but moreso of Al and Peggy. Peggy supposedly married Al on a dare. Al proposed to Peggy "only" because he's drunk. A lot of this is just a vehicle for the comedic aspects of the show but looking at it generally, any money they could use to improve their lives is wasted on frivolous things and momentary pleasures.
 

John Doe

Avenger
Jan 24, 2018
3,443
I made a similar thread about the Simpsons once. As far as Homer is concerned, I think Abe sold his house to help Homer buy his home and then Homer promptly threw him in an old folk's home. So that explains the house.

Day to day living? Marge makes the money they earn stretch and although she's primarily a stay at home mom, she's held down various jobs over the years.

I'm also not sure how canon that cheque is meant to be. Burns is a miser but I vaguely remember an ep where there was a flashback about Homer's job interview and the other candidates were graduates from some of the most prestigious universities in the country. Lenny and Craig also have Master's degrees. The point being, the salaries at the power plant can't be that low.
 

BlinkBlank

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,226
Some of you take this way too literally.

It's a sitcom where the house is the main stage. You need people on that stage and give them room to act.
That limits how small they could have made Al Bundy house.

Some of you also need to understand that back when the show was on, people didn't discuss shit like this online. Nobody cared and even if someone did, they couldn't make videos about on YouTube.
I think on the other side of that is that it creates an incredibly warped view of affordability. But I get it, if every show was showing how most of the population lived, it would not be interesting or sellable.


I know it is kind of off topic, but same deal. "Comcast internet essentials" package shows a commerical with these "consumers" of their low-income package fairly well off. I understand that life happens and you can go from having a nice house to losing your job and needing to apply for these programs, but come on. A 2-story house in CA and on their low income internet package Let's get real.

2TGF6u.md.jpg
 

regenhuber

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,201
I think on the other side of that is that it creates an incredibly warped view of affordability. But I get it, if every show was showing how most of the population lived, it would not be interesting or sellable.

In defense of the people who made these shows: It simply would have been undoable.

The logistics kinda dictate a minimum size for houses. You don't really want 4 people cramped up in a small room, with no space to move around.

340

Would be really tough to make this shot work in a more realistic sized home (adjusted for Al's income).
Not even talking about actors running, jumping and falling.


13e48b17a89b03965d007e11aef479b0.jpg


We didn't really get "The Office" or "Parks & Rec" style comedies back then.
The ground floor of the starring families home was where 90% of the typical 80s/90s family sitcom took place.
They all looked like that, OK sometimes the entrance was on the left and the kitchen was on the right side of our screen lol
 

Deleted member 6056

Oct 25, 2017
7,240
The Simpsons started in 1989, 30 years ago. That picture is probably decades old. That's why the $amount probably doesn't make sense to you.

Um no. I have the old payscales at work posted by the current ones. Thats not why.
He would not have been making 9 to 12 an hour even then. Even at 25 an hour which was 90s plant wages he would have pulled in 1000 gross for 40 hrs not a measly 362.12

Even if you round up his buying power for inflation compared to todays dollar hes still short quite a lot. You can google value of a dollar by year to compare with a conversion calculator. Hes nowhere near the 1989 spending equivalent of the 1000 to 1400 ish gross he should be making.
 
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Cheerilee

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,969
If he bought the house around when Kelly was born, early 70s, it was before a really bad period of inflation in the country.

united-states-inflation-cpi.png


A fixed mortgage payment in 1970 would be really cheap in 1985 after inflation. It's one of the reasons boomers benefited so much from real estate they bought while young. Later on they could sell or take equity loans just because they had houses that went up in value so much. Minorities were typically locked out of many of these opportunities.
Al peaked in high school.

Supposedly he bought his Dodge brand new in his final year of high school, and got a "temporary" job at the shoe store to pay for it. Then on the day that he scored four touchdowns in a single game, he had sex with Peggy (the school's hottest slut, basically the Kelly of her era) in the back seat of his new car, and Peggy got pregnant with Kelly, which steered Al into a (literal) shotgun marriage.

Al's temporary job then became permanent, as he desperately needed a job to keep up payments on his new car, while supporting Peggy and Kelly (and then Bud), and buying a house became a part of that marital obligation.

Al bemoans the institution of marriage as the destroyer of his life and claims to hate it, but at the same time, he's also 1000% committed to it.