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6 months ago Gears 5 overtook Fortnite as Most Played Xbox Game. Today it's 45th.

Stowaway Silfer

Stowaway Silfer

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
32,819
Well written OP, it was interesting to read through.

I played Gears 5 up to Act 3 I think then fell off and haven't really went back. I might in the future but while I had a decent time, I think it's not as appealing of a series to me anymore. The additions they made like the robot and open world felt weird and unnecessary and didn't really strengthen the game for me.

Though I don't doubt MS is probably confident in the IP and satisfied with its result since their purchase, I'd like to see what The Coalition could do on their own New IP, free from the expectations and limits of a pre-existing franchise.
(I'd kinda like to see a similar thing with 343 which is in a similar situation of being tied to a franchise they didn't create simply because it was big and have struggled with new entries. But maybe Infinite will convince me they're better off staying on Halo)
 
Prine

Prine

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
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Oct 25, 2017
15,724
It's one of the best horde modes I've played. Got together with 5 of my friends for the first time to play it and we had a blast.

The SP is brilliant, and MP is so much fun from what I played, 60fps combined with those visuals is extremely rare to experience, I think Coalition have done alot right. Gears is in perfect hands.
 
ghostcrew

ghostcrew

The Shrouded Ghost
Administrator
Oct 27, 2017
30,349
It's the last few days of the current Operation at the moment. New Operation/Battle Pass/content literally drops tomorrow so I bet the game will see a decent bump over the next few weeks.

Often see live games like this get a boost every time there's a content drop. Gears Operations last a decent time (3 months I think?) and I imagine by the end of them most regular players have easily polished off all of the content.
 
Tawpgun

Tawpgun

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
9,861
Rodelero said:
I just don't see how Gears is proving value to Microsoft at this point given the opportunity cost of having such a talented studio building something most people are tired of. As I mentioned earlier, I think you can see from God of War 2016 and Horizon Zero Dawn what the upshot is of doing something different.
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It's one thing to make a single player game do something different. I have no qualms in Gears making its single player more intereresting. They certainly tried in Gears 5. I thought the light RPG and exploration elements were a step in the right direciton.

But changing the MP is something a lot more controversial. If you remove the wall bouncing shotgun battles Gears MP is boring as all hell. Shooting a lancer from cover at someome roadie running isn't that fun.

Now... Can they do a spinoff that is maybe first person? Sure. Can the singleplayer dive deep into survival horror? Sure.

But chasing the popular trends of the day is stupid with existing franchises. They have dedicated fanbases. Make a game that ensures they are happy and then focus on making it good for everyone else.
 

Deleted member 54073

User requested account closure
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Feb 22, 2019
3,983
Gears 5 was a 7 out of 10 game for me. Looked nice but apart from that it just felt like a dated third person shooter in a series that should be left alone for a while.
 
Smash-It Stan

Smash-It Stan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,261
Because the studio has no idea how to make a multiplayer game. This thread is about gears 5 yet every single complaint can also be said for gears 4, another gears game that no one played. Everyone bowed out after 3, no one played judgement and gears 4 was such a wet fart of a game that whatever interest that was still around left right after. Stories a mess with uninteresting characters and the multiplayer is so schizophrenic with not knowing what it wants to be but keeping one thing consistent, microtransactions and ignoring fans.

Is that number that beat fortnite the number of players that BOUGHT the game for $60? Because it was gaming news everywhere how you could use the game pass to play the game, pretty sure thats prime evidence that it brings 0 retention.
 
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RF Switch

RF Switch

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
4,118
They fumbled hard and it's a shame because my entire group of friends jumped in. The majority of them wouldn't have ever touched the game if it wasnt for gamepass they loved the atmosphere and gameplay but there didn't seem to be enough content for gears beginners at launch. Every game we were smoked by vets of the game. You also couldn't have a party more than 3 I think in arcade mode which also hurt us because we wanted to play together but ranked was the only option. Other games came and gears 5 was off the radar.
 

aember

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,026
ghostcrew said:
It's the last few days of the current Operation at the moment. New Operation/Battle Pass/content literally drops tomorrow so I bet the game will see a decent bump over the next few weeks.

Often see live games like this get a boost every time there's a content drop. Gears Operations last a decent time (3 months I think?) and I imagine by the end of them most regular players have easily polished off all of the content.
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Not for long. A single new map in 3 (or was it 4?) months is not how you bring people back.
 
ghostcrew

ghostcrew

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Administrator
Oct 27, 2017
30,349
aember said:
Not for long. A single new map in 3 (or was it 4?) months is not how you bring people back.
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It's more than a new map though isn't it? It's two new maps (new to Gears 5 - yes one of them is the classic Canals), two reworked maps for new 2v2 modes, four new heroes, one brand new mode, a new Tour of Duty, and a new environment for Escape.

I think the Tour of Duty alone brings players back. I finished Operation 2s absolutely ages ago and my play slowed well down after that. I haven't played in weeks. Totally playing again tomorrow though.
 
OtterX

OtterX

Member
Mar 12, 2020
1,795
boxingiscool said:
I love Gears but I hate that we get one once every two years. It's not exciting anymore to me. I've had 7 games since 06. That's 2 a year. I'm good man. Do something new. An action adventure game in the Killer Instinct universe. A platformer with conker. Perfect Dark with cyberpunk being so big
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This. We've gotten so many Gears games, just like Halo before it. We got 5 halo games on the 360. That's a ton. I love both of these franchises, but can we try to do something different? How can they develop more AAA IPs if they're too busy bleeding the same franchises dry over and over again? Somethings gonna give and it has with both Halo and Gears. People get tired of the same thing all the time and you can't just push the "reinvent" button. What if no one likes it or it's not very good? Then it's dead and you killed it.
 

Deleted member 16908

Oct 27, 2017
9,377
Rodelero said:
This is clearly true, but I fear Gears is in much worse shape than Halo.
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I don't know anyone who gives a fuck about Gears of War in 2020. The last game I saw people really excited about was 3.

I personally think the Gears of War cover-shooter formula is dated and boring, and the studio should come up with a new IP with some new ideas instead of trying to shoehorn stuff into new Gears titles.
 
medyej

medyej

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,421
Gears multiplayer just isn't fun. The glory days people think of when Gears 1 came out was when everyone was knew and basically played it like a third person counter-strike. Nowadays any new player is going to join into a bunch of wall bouncing auto-aim shotgunning bullshit and quit immediately. They catered to the minority of players remaining who embraced that type of gameplay that drove everyone else away, when really they need to totally overhaul the MP into something new.

Horde has also been overcomplicated and is no longer a fun mode to just jump in and shoot shit.
 
DevilMayGuy

DevilMayGuy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,573
Texas
grandwizorb said:
Gears multiplayer just isn't fun. The glory days people think of when Gears 1 came out was when everyone was knew and basically played it like a third person counter-strike. Nowadays any new player is going to join into a bunch of wall bouncing auto-aim shotgunning bullshit and quit immediately. They catered to the minority of players remaining who embraced that type of gameplay that drove everyone else away, when really they need to totally overhaul the MP into something new.

Horde has also been overcomplicated and is no longer a fun mode to just jump in and shoot shit.
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This is where I'm at
 

Deleted member 13015

User requested account closure
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Oct 27, 2017
2,266
The multiplayer is not the main problem for me, but yes the online is a casual repellent. New players vs fans who have been playing the games, with most of the same mechanics, for 10+ years. Not to mention the shotgun-centric gameplay that can put a lot of people off.

It's a hard game online, but also kinda old-fashioned with its camera/movement. Not bad, but quaint... a relic of last-gen.
 
OneBadMutha

OneBadMutha

Member
Nov 2, 2017
6,059
The multiplayer doesn't lend itself to expansion or bringing in new players which is an issue for the long term health of any multiplayer game. No doubt the franchise needs a shake-up.

That said, the campaign was well received by the majority. Single player games which have had multiple sequels without a major reboot, more than 1 release per a generation and can be beaten in less than 15 hours on the hardest difficulty don't have lasting mindshare. There's barely an exception.
 
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Rodelero

Rodelero

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Oct 27, 2017
11,509
Tawpgun said:
It's one thing to make a single player game do something different. I have no qualms in Gears making its single player more intereresting. They certainly tried in Gears 5. I thought the light RPG and exploration elements were a step in the right direciton.

But changing the MP is something a lot more controversial. If you remove the wall bouncing shotgun battles Gears MP is boring as all hell. Shooting a lancer from cover at someome roadie running isn't that fun.
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Yes, removing wall-bouncing on its own would not solve the problem. Gears needs to appear like it is moving forward and moving away from having what is effectively an exploit being core to the game's meta would be a side effect of that. The suggestion I made in the OP is overhauling movement mechanics so that things are much more fluid generally, on the basis that wall bouncing is effective and popular because of how relatively sluggish and restrictive all the alternatives are.
 
Klaphat

Klaphat

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Dec 18, 2017
751
They need to make a Gears game like Destiny, The Division and other looter shooters/light RPG. Those are the games that have longevity. There are exactly zero popular multiplayer horde or arena games. It's either battle royale, mobas or tactical shooters.

It's the same reason why no one is playing Quake anymore. Those days are over.

It's kinda crazy that Microsoft does not have a Destiny like game. I think Gears would be great as an open world looter shooter. The gameplay is still really fun, it's just everything around it that's meh and honestly the drone thingy and the light rpg elements made the gameplay a lot better.

One of the few things i though was a gimmick and then it turned out to be a great addition.
 
Malcolm9

Malcolm9

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Oct 27, 2017
3,040
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Klaphat said:
They need to make a Gears game like Destiny, The Division and other looter shooters/light RPG. Those are the games that have longevity. There are exactly zero popular multiplayer horde or arena games. It's either battle royale, mobas or tactical shooters.

It's the same reason why no one is playing Quake anymore. Those days are over.

It's kinda crazy that Microsoft does not have a Destiny like game. I think Gears would be great as an open world looter shooter. The gameplay is still really fun, it's just everything around it that's meh and honestly the drone thingy and the light rpg elements made the gameplay a lot better.

One of the few things i though was a gimmick and then it turned out to be a great addition.
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If you want to kill the series off then yeah.
 
Fisty

Fisty

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Oct 25, 2017
20,207
They can support 5 indefinitely, serve that hardcore base.

They desperately need a formula change for 6 though, complete overhaul to all aspects of the game. Drop the multi altogether if necessary, if that means annoying the base then whatever. They need a strong foundation to build off of for the 20's and using the same formula from the late 00's ain't gonna do it
 
Charsace

Charsace

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Nov 22, 2017
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People don't want shooters that require a high level of execution to be above average. This is what killed Quake Champions and Cliffy B's game.
 
Tawpgun

Tawpgun

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
9,861
Klaphat said:
They need to make a Gears game like Destiny, The Division and other looter shooters/light RPG. Those are the games that have longevity. There are exactly zero popular multiplayer horde or arena games. It's either battle royale, mobas or tactical shooters.

It's the same reason why no one is playing Quake anymore. Those days are over.

It's kinda crazy that Microsoft does not have a Destiny like game. I think Gears would be great as an open world looter shooter. The gameplay is still really fun, it's just everything around it that's meh and honestly the drone thingy and the light rpg elements made the gameplay a lot better.

One of the few things i though was a gimmick and then it turned out to be a great addition.
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I'd be ok with this and you are right.

The age of those drop in, play, drop out is kind of over. People want to feel like they are working toward something. I personally hate it but hey thats the industry. Shame theres not really a market for a AAA game like L4D anymore.

Gears definitely can be a lot cooler with loot than something like Division. Power armor, locust weapons, etc. Just the right amount of future + alien biology.
 
I KILL PXLS

I KILL PXLS

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Oct 25, 2017
11,520
Klaphat said:
They need to make a Gears game like Destiny, The Division and other looter shooters/light RPG. Those are the games that have longevity.
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Honestly, I'd kind of be in to that. I'd rather they put the Shadowrun IP to use and give it that treatment, but a Gears one could work too. But only as a spin off. I think it still makes sense to at least keep making the cinematic campaigns.
 

aember

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Oct 26, 2017
1,026
ghostcrew said:
It's more than a new map though isn't it? It's two new maps (new to Gears 5 - yes one of them is the classic Canals), two reworked maps for new 2v2 modes, four new heroes, one brand new mode, a new Tour of Duty, and a new environment for Escape.

I think the Tour of Duty alone brings players back. I finished Operation 2s absolutely ages ago and my play slowed well down after that. I haven't played in weeks. Totally playing again tomorrow though.
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I guess, when you list it out like that, sure.

I just wrote a huge reply, but after rereading it I realized why all of the listed things make me despise this game and just make me go play OG gears, so I'll just concede and shut up. I'm just not part of the target playerbase in TC's eyes.
 
RingRang

RingRang

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Oct 2, 2019
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I'm fine with these straight forward third person shooter action games and I'm frustrated by people thinking that every series has to radically evolve.

Gears of War and Uncharted are two of my favorite series from the last decade, and I hope they continue on.
 
Goodacre0081

Goodacre0081

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Oct 25, 2017
2,756
The day that MS announced it's acquisition of the IP I had a dreadful feeling it was for the worst. I knew what they were going to do to with it, live service, esport push, egregious MTX models. It all came true at some point along the line and now we even have the diehard players questioning if this thing will even be around in 4 years.

Maybe this isn't how a major publisher should do things, buying up IP's without the creatives who made them. It's Halo all over again.

The Coalition is very aware of the dissatisfaction fans have with the state of the game and it's a constant point they acknowledge on dev streams. It's been 6 months of apologies, "we're listening", and "it's coming". IMO I blame a bunch of this on Microsoft themselves due to the game simply not being ready and MS's pathetic first party to fill a 2019 Holiday rush, it was sacrificed despite not being ready.
 
elenarie

elenarie

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Jun 10, 2018
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Played through the singleplayer, loved it.

Played through the multiplayer in Arcade only, for about 10 hours, loved it, but I had enough. Arena style shooters don't hold me much these days, and the regular Gears MP is too hardcore and not something I am interested in.

I imagine a lot of people are in the same boat.
 
OP
OP
Rodelero

Rodelero

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Oct 27, 2017
11,509
Tawpgun said:
The age of those drop in, play, drop out is kind of over. People want to feel like they are working toward something. I personally hate it but hey thats the industry. Shame theres not really a market for a AAA game like L4D anymore.
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I don't really think this is valid. These are the multiplayer centric shooters in the Top 20.

(1) Fortnite
(2) Modern Warfare
(5) Rainbow Six Siege
(7) Apex Legends
(10) Destiny 2
(14) Overwatch
(16) Black Ops IIII

Aside from Destiny 2, these are all games that focus on match based multiplayer. Fortnite, Rainbow Six, Apex and Overwatch don't incorporate any gameplay affecting progression at all. What you probably could conclude is that classic arena based shooters aren't remotely as popular as they once were, but I'm not entirely sure why people would draw a line that has Halo/Gears as arena games and Call of Duty's primary multiplayer not.
 
Xbox Live Mike

Xbox Live Mike

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Oct 29, 2017
2,434
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I played through the single player campaign and enjoyed it but lost interest in the multiplayer not long after, I prefer faster paced games with larger arenas these days. There are a lot of games trying to keep you coming back and Gears couldn't do that for me.
 
Fabtacular

Fabtacular

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Jul 11, 2019
4,244
I think the standard for success and longevity of a multiplayer game, especially one that's associated with a single-player campaign, is different than it was for 360-era titles.

So many multiplayer-focused F2P games are out now that it's a lot harder to keep momentum up.

Gears previously would have competed with COD/Battlefield and a handful of AA-type multiplayer shooters back in those days. Now it competes with all of those, plus Fortnite/Apex/PUBG/Warframe/R6:S/etc.

Next Gears multiplayer needs to be F2P BR. Personally I think it would be very well-suited for that.
 
Bansai

Bansai

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Oct 28, 2017
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To me almost everything felt worse than 4, which is a curious take, I'm aware. But after wrapping up campaign in 5 once and playing a couple of horde/pvp matches, I was out. A stark contrast to 4 where I replayed campaign a lot and spent quite a while in multiplayer.

The horde improvements felt too tacky and bloated the campaign overall didn't gel with me, never liked Cait and Del so it's not too surprising I didn't take too kindly to playing as them for majority of 5.
 
Betelgeuse

Betelgeuse

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Nov 2, 2017
2,941
Between its freefall on XBL's most played and its poor sales performance - less than 4, which was a large decline from Judgment - all signs point to the game and franchise having a pretty small fanbase for a AAA title.

And despite how much ado was made about 5 being shot in the arm that would shake up and revitalize the franchise, it failed to do so. The LTTPs I read rightfully recognize how flawed the campaign was, particularly with respect to story and pacing. The game didn't achieve any mindshare for the franchise or Xbox overall.

Given all this, I don't know what is it still doing being positioned as an Xbox tentpole franchise to which one of MS best studios is dedicated - one of few that is capable of producing technically cutting edge, high-budget games.

It's time to move on. The franchise has had 6 mainline entries, which is an incredible run. The Coalitiion stands to achieve significantly greater success and mindshare given a new or at least different IP.

Of course, I'm sure we're getting 6, so much of this is in vain.
 
Tawpgun

Tawpgun

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
9,861
Rodelero said:
I don't really think this is valid. These are the multiplayer centric shooters in the Top 20.

(1) Fortnite
(2) Modern Warfare
(5) Rainbow Six Siege
(7) Apex Legends
(10) Destiny 2
(14) Overwatch
(16) Black Ops IIII

Aside from Destiny 2, these are all games that focus on match based multiplayer. Fortnite, Rainbow Six, Apex and Overwatch don't incorporate any gameplay affecting progression at all. What you probably could conclude is that classic arena based shooters aren't remotely as popular as they once were, but I'm not entirely sure why people would draw a line that has Halo/Gears as arena games and Call of Duty's primary multiplayer not.
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The post I was describing also mentioned that the most popular games now are BR's, MOBA's or looter RPG's. So that list largely checks out aside from the massive CoD staying power and the outlier of Rainbow Six. The point was, no one is playing Arena shooters anymore.

CoD is a much more casual offering in its primary MP than Gears or Halo. Gears is insanely hardocre. Halo still has map pick ups.
 
DStubbs

DStubbs

Member
Oct 28, 2017
369
Gears really just needs a break. Everything I've seen from the fifth game looks good and I've heard really good things but... I just don't care. It never felt like there was a big appetite for another Gears from what I can tell. Really wish Microsoft would've put there resources towards something new.
 
Digital Savior

Digital Savior

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Nov 8, 2017
1,573
Campaign was fun. Multiplayer was rather lackluster. All modes. There's gotta be a better way to do horde or a PvE mode.
 
ShinUltramanJ

ShinUltramanJ

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,949
There's much better multiplayer shooters to invest in.
I couldn't bring myself to finish the campaign, the loop is way to monotonous for me.
 
BladeRunner2099

BladeRunner2099

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Aug 26, 2018
1,793
I loved Gears 5, it was a 8/10 game for me.

From an identity perspective, Gears needs to always be 3 things for me:

1. Aim to be the most graphically sublime game for Unreal Engine ( Top 5)
2. Aim to be the best TPS out there
3. Aim to provide a genre defining Horde type of MP mode like OG Gears.

If you look at Gears 5, they are kind of there but No.3 was a disaster ( Escape is not nearly as fun as I would have hoped)
 
superNESjoe

superNESjoe

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Oct 26, 2017
1,160
I have nothing but praise for Gears 5. I genuinely love the game as a long-time fan of the series (been playing since the launch of Gears 1). I think the Coalition showed they can make genuinely excellent Gears games, so it isn't really an issue with quality.

I think maybe the franchise may have just run its course. I used to play Gears damn near every night for literally years, and at a certain point I just kind of got over it. I played Gears 5, loved the campaign, played a small amount of the multiplayer offerings and kind of forgot it was installed on my HDD. I think there has to be a lot of people in the same position as me that played and loved the game but maybe in terms of sticking to it when there's so much else to play these days...I dunno. I guess the excitement for it is over.

The franchise either needs something to make it compelling and exciting again, or it needs to go dormant for a while. The sad reality is that some franchises can be evergreen, and same can't. I don't think Gears has the makings of a franchise like Zelda, Mario, Mega Man, Sonic, etc to be evergreen.
 
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