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Gully Bully

Member
Aug 19, 2019
145
The democratic president after Trump is going to get blamed for this.

Yep. Biggest reason why this country called America is trash and has been since George W. Bush's time.

Patriotism in this country for anyone outside of Servbot's demographic is for the birds at this point. Who still wants to be an American patriot? Citizenship is out of necessity, I understand it. But patriotism? Not in your right mind.
 

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,145
This, alongside This. Are the reason why I always get pissed when they constantly talk about how great the economy is doing for the "American People".

Jeez, America. Am I reading it right, the 18k isn't even minimum wage?

In Denmark the minimum wage is something like 31k a year.

And you guys don't have to deal with the bullshit of healthcare. I would gladly pay a set amount of my salary to not have to deal with this shit.
 

Audioboxer

Banned
Nov 14, 2019
2,943
And I'm sure most of these people have great healthcare.

All America needs is another amazing Centrist to lead again and everything will get fixed.
 

turbobrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
Phoenix, AZ
Jeez, America. Am I reading it right, the 18k isn't even minimum wage?

In Denmark the minimum wage is something like 31k a year.

Depends on the location. The federal minimum wage is under that, but states can set their own.

I live in Arizona and our minimum wage is $11/hour ($12/hour starting next year), which if you work full time is just over $22k/year. Still terrible, but at least our cost of living isn't crazy high.
 

Foffy

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,394
But hey LOLJOBS numbers.

Cultish admiration for abtractions leaves us forced to make up a reality that somehow justifies the precarity and poverty we face. Personal blaming is the easiest and shittiest route to do this.

People on this very forum are victim to this poisonous, garbage realm of thought.
 
Last edited:
Oct 29, 2017
3,287
I am really scared thinking about the reality that some people have to try living around a minimum wage. I thought it was rough handling $10 an hour in my metro area living with family.
 

Doc Kelso

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,165
NYC
Most peoples pay is in direct relation to the service They provide. If It's a job that most people can do you aren't getting paid well in general. That's not changing ever.
I have met precious few people whom are in possession of a skill that makes them particularly unique and well-suited for their job, especially at entry-level jobs that still pay well. Flipping burgers is a more difficult job than many jobs that pay $30k-40k/yr due to dealing with customers.
 

Soda

Member
Oct 26, 2017
8,877
Dunedin, New Zealand
This wealth disparity makes me want to become a wealth hoarder, because I fear for just how bad things will get when everything crashes down. Gotta insulate myself and my family as much as I can from climate change as-is, but let's throw a looming economic crash and social turmoil into the mix, as well.
 

KtotheRoc

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
56,667
This is absolutely awful and completely unsustainable. I fear for the future.
 
Oct 27, 2017
45,259
Seattle
Let's not forget the thread is about people who have to do all that on much less. The point of my post was not if you feel rich or not but maybe you can understand why a good chunk of the country sees you as rich. I regret bringing it up because I didn't mean to reignite the debate about if 100k is rich or not in a thread about how 44% of US workers make roughly a 5th of that.

Absolutely, I didn't intend to steer that conversation, I'm thankful every day and realize how lucky I am compared to most
 

Deffers

Banned
Mar 4, 2018
2,402
This wealth disparity makes me want to become a wealth hoarder, because I fear for just how bad things will get when everything crashes down. Gotta insulate myself and my family as much as I can from climate change as-is, but let's throw a looming economic crash and social turmoil into the mix, as well.
This is an easy cognitive trap to fall into, but don't forget that the importance of your wealth is predicated only on the supply chains remaining in place. Unless you're rich enough to build a bunker out in New Zealand, your best bet isn't with the money in your bank account, it's with the people around you. Always has been, always will be.
 

Opto

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,546
This is absolutely awful and completely unsustainable. I fear for the future.
This is probably anecdotal, but I feel like even the quality of goods across the board has gone down in order to reach these lower income markets. At Target I remember getting some decent quality dishes in 08, but ten years later everything feels like it'll snap in half
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,580
Racoon City
Yep. Biggest reason why this country called America is trash and has been since George W. Bush's time.

Patriotism in this country for anyone outside of Servbot's demographic is for the birds at this point. Who still wants to be an American patriot? Citizenship is out of necessity, I understand it. But patriotism? Not in your right mind.

Ehhhh we can easily go back way further than that.
 

Richietto

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,000
North Carolina
14-inequality-1.nocrop.w710.h2147483647.png


That US graph is straight up a representation of a heist, complete with hostages.

Low wages, anti-worker laws, and a psychopathic for-profit healthcare system is the good ol days to way too many people. And when the not wealthy parrot those same "halcyon" days where they were getting fucked but with a smile, it's basically stockholm syndrome.
Those graphs make me want to vomit. This country is fucked.
 

feline fury

Member
Dec 8, 2017
1,542
14-inequality-1.nocrop.w710.h2147483647.png


That US graph is straight up a representation of a heist, complete with hostages.

Low wages, anti-worker laws, and a psychopathic for-profit healthcare system is the good ol days to way too many people. And when the not wealthy parrot those same "halcyon" days where they were getting fucked but with a smile, it's basically stockholm syndrome.
That's a depressing graph for American exceptionalism.
 

TAJ

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
12,446
I couldn't even make rent on $18,000. My annual rent is something like $21,000.

I am always surprised when I see these "making less than $30,000" threads. Seems almost undoable unless you have super cheap rent or food stamps or something.

It was a lot easier before AirBnB. Almost every place I've lived as an adult is an AirBnB now.
Even the apartment my family lived in when the US Navy sent by dad to Spain is a vacation rental now.
 

Failburger

Banned
Dec 3, 2018
2,455
Y'all wonder how people make so little money manage to survive? Come to my neighborhood and see how almost every house has at least 2 families in it.
 

Pelican

Member
Oct 26, 2017
424
Hopefully whoever wins the democratic primary pretends to care about poor people in the rust belt so they can get back the blue wall...at least for a little while until nothing happens for said people and the next republican swings by with some solid "I will totally help you!" content.
 

BobLoblaw

This Guy Helps
Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,307
Depressing. What are the odds that someone can actually break through that shit and end up being able to retire comfortably? One in a thousand? One in ten thousand?
 

SlothmanAllen

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,834
I think if you could get the average wager close to $20-25 and hour with good benefits, most people would be happy. Obviously you'd still have minimum wage jobs, but less people would be making that amount.
 

TheIlliterati

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,782
Planning for retirement for me means hoping I can afford Gravy Lovers brand cat food for all my meals. My cat will be dead by then, and I'll reap all the tasty rewards!
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,475
Jeez, America. Am I reading it right, the 18k isn't even minimum wage?

In Denmark the minimum wage is something like 31k a year.

Minimum wage is...$7.25/hr at the federal level. $7.25 * 40 hours a week * 52 weeks year = $15,080. It also hasn't moved since I graduated high school. I'm 32.

My wife and I pull in around 100k and while we're not exactly struggling, we still have to be very careful with expenses with two kids. Hell, I haven't been able to afford a proper vacation in over 4 years.

I wouldn't call $100k that comes from two different incomes and also has two children "rich" by any means. Now if you both made $200k I'd have to revisit the conversation lol.

Most peoples pay is in direct relation to the service They provide. If It's a job that most people can do you aren't getting paid well in general. That's not changing ever.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you're stating this is the way things are, rather than "this is how things should be". But even with that, it's probably going to have to change because quite frankly most jobs are jobs most people can do. There are some jobs which can only be done by trained individuals, but those aren't the majority.
 

oneils

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,112
Ottawa Canada
The take away seems to be that a higher education doesn't guarantee a "good" job, but most of the people who have one of these jobs do have a degree.

Anyone thinking of skipping college should probably reconsider unless they have serious talent.
 

Gyro Zeppeli

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,289
A lot of people on this forum really are oblivious to the suffrage that is going on in America, and that's directly tied to their current income level and comfort that they're experiencing. Never fails to surprise me how conservative it gets around here when matters of finance and the economy comes up. Even in this very thread, there are people who say a person is worth what skills they have, instead of looking at it from a humane point of view--to give people a living wage. We must evaluate what it means to work and to have a job. It's poisoning our minds.
 
Apr 4, 2019
2,915
Greater Toronto Area
A lot of people on this forum really are oblivious to the suffrage that is going on in America, and that's directly tied to their current income level and comfort that they're experiencing. Never fails to surprise me how conservative it gets around here when matters of finance and the economy comes up. Even in this very thread, there are people who say a person is worth what skills they have, instead of looking at it from a humane point of view--to give people a living wage. We must evaluate what it means to work and to have a job. It's poisoning our minds.

As someone who has two jobs I feel that vibe here too.
 

ninnanuam

Member
Nov 24, 2017
1,956
The take away seems to be that a higher education doesn't guarantee a "good" job, but most of the people who have one of these jobs do have a degree.

Anyone thinking of skipping college should probably reconsider unless they have serious talent.

Hypothetically, setting aside the actual worth of degrees and their prohibitive costs, let's imagine that everyone is capable of getting a degree, and they do? What's the actual outcome?

A very likely outcome would be degree creep and an increased pool of workers with degrees which would only serve to drag down salaries.

Degrees unfortunately are not an endgame solution for poverty as they only work if they are not ubiquitous.
 

chezzymann

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,042
I'm nearing 100k and I would definitely classify it as rich. It's enough to buy luxury items whenever I feel like it without budgeting.
Theres a lot of people that can afford a nice 4 bedroom house, 2 new cars every 6 or so years, support 2 kids comfortably and save for retirement all without being in a bunch of debt and think that that's "normal". Unfortunately, its rich now.
 

XMonkey

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,827
14-inequality-1.nocrop.w710.h2147483647.png


That US graph is straight up a representation of a heist, complete with hostages.

Low wages, anti-worker laws, and a psychopathic for-profit healthcare system is the good ol days to way too many people. And when the not wealthy parrot those same "halcyon" days where they were getting fucked but with a smile, it's basically stockholm syndrome.
This is all you really need to know. The American people have been getting robbed for decades. It's long past time we took that wealth back.
 

shenden

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,306
So no minimum wage jobs have health insurance? And reading day in, day out about rents getting higher and no rise in wages is fucking nuts. How can politics not see a disaster in the horizon?

And how does the american pension system look like?
 

Foffy

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,394
A lot of people on this forum really are oblivious to the suffrage that is going on in America, and that's directly tied to their current income level and comfort that they're experiencing. Never fails to surprise me how conservative it gets around here when matters of finance and the economy comes up. Even in this very thread, there are people who say a person is worth what skills they have, instead of looking at it from a humane point of view--to give people a living wage. We must evaluate what it means to work and to have a job. It's poisoning our minds.

I would go a step further and say any society that demands jobs as survival value is inherently violent and ill equipped for the 21st century. I'd be shocked if even a quarter of this website would find such a statement agreeable or truthful, however...

Living wages mean nothing if we're planning to automate at least a third of the working population out of the system wholesale, or to normalize working conditions because of benefits, or to say real work is jobs because they only have market value. All of these positions are ones of violence because of the way we do things.
 

Moist_Owlet

Banned
Dec 26, 2017
4,148
So no minimum wage jobs have health insurance? And reading day in, day out about rents getting higher and no rise in wages is fucking nuts. How can politics not see a disaster in the horizon?

And how does the american pension system look like?
FUCKING LOL THATS A GOOD ONE. You should be a comedian.
 
Oct 25, 2017
10,767
Toronto, ON
Yeah, unemployment rate doesn't mean shit when you've got terrible paying jobs with terrible benefits.

Yeah, this is the sad thing...unemployment rates being down is all well and good, but if the jobs that people have are just temporary triage treatments while they sink further into debt, get sicker, and can't see any light at the end of the tunnel, that's a different kind of disaster in its own right.

So no minimum wage jobs have health insurance? And reading day in, day out about rents getting higher and no rise in wages is fucking nuts. How can politics not see a disaster in the horizon?

And how does the american pension system look like?

Nope, no health insurance for those jobs...lots of folks are really screwed long term, it's going to really screw the US in the not too distant future.
 

Nude_Tayne

Member
Jan 8, 2018
3,673
earth
wow some ppl actually believe 100k is rich lol
I imagine it's young single people who are making 25k a year and imagining what their current life would be like with 4x the income. Of course real life doesn't work like that when you have a family and need to pay for family things and save for a decent retirement.

You're not rich until you make enough money to live really well, not have to worry about retirement, and never have to worry about money in general.
 
Oct 28, 2017
8,071
2001
You need to be making six-figures to be happy living in Dallas, according to a new analysis.
A survey from Purdue University and GoBankingRates.com found that you need an annual salary of $113,085 to be happy in Dallas. It also found that people need to be making between $64,620 and $80,775 annually for their emotional well-being.



The study argued that the optimal amount of money it takes to be happy varies worldwide.
"That might be surprising as what we see on TV and what advertisers tell us we need would indicate that there is no ceiling when it comes to how much money is needed for happiness, but we now see there are some thresholds," said Andrew T. Jebb, a doctoral student and the lead author of the Purdue University study, in a press release.
The research specifically sought to pinpoint the amount where money no longer changed a person's level of emotional well-being. Emotional well-being was measured according to a person's day-to-day emotions, including happy, excited, sad and angry.
The survey also found that in Los Angeles you need to earn $204,855 to be happy, in New York City, you need to earn $219,765, and you need to make a whopping $319,935 annually to be happy in San Francisco.
Nationally, the study says that the ideal salary needed to be happy is roughly $105,000, they say that's generally enough to make people feel comfortable and happy enough to explore bigger goals. The Purdue researchers determined that, globally, individuals would need an income of $60,000 and $75,000 for emotional well-being.
 

Opto

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,546
So no minimum wage jobs have health insurance? And reading day in, day out about rents getting higher and no rise in wages is fucking nuts. How can politics not see a disaster in the horizon?

And how does the american pension system look like?
We don't have one. We have Social Security, which is really just supplemental at this point and tied to the income levels of their earning years (so people that earned a lot of money get to take more SS than people who didn't earn a lot). Some companies offer 401ks which are investment funds with built in retirement dates but these are also not enough if you're an average worker at said companies (and probably not offered or feasible to the 44%). Also those 401ks never meant to replace company pension plans but did. American is headed towards a huge impoverished retirement class
 

zoltek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,917
How do these numbers compare to the rest of the world? These numbers in a vacuum mean nothing without context.