Didn't they just have a showcase where they announced several traditional new games, new IPs etc. Where's your proof?
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2 years into Gamepass, plus 2.5 years additional paidfor. Still thinking whats the catch
- Thread starter Phonzo
- Start date
The only "catch" I can think of, is that if MIcrosoft can convince like...nearly everyone who has an Xbox (and even PC now) to have and keep a GP subscription, then in the future, they will make BANK on this.
More subs makes it a better and better proposition for them. So, with all these crazy deals, 1st party games, 200 other games, new shit releasing on it that's 3rd party - I think this is all a long game they are playing.
In 5-10 years if dozens of millions of people have GP, pay around $10 a month, and keep it, they will be making
so. much. money.
No catch....it's a long game that gets better as long as subs keep going up. Right?
More subs makes it a better and better proposition for them. So, with all these crazy deals, 1st party games, 200 other games, new shit releasing on it that's 3rd party - I think this is all a long game they are playing.
In 5-10 years if dozens of millions of people have GP, pay around $10 a month, and keep it, they will be making
so. much. money.
No catch....it's a long game that gets better as long as subs keep going up. Right?
Well I am not saying that it will happen, I am saying it could happen.
If Microsoft are successful in convincing an increasingly large portion of their console userbase to consume games primarily or even exclusively through Game Pass, which given how hard they are pushing it doesn't seem outside the realms of possibility, then that grants them a far greater degree of control over distribution of games on their console. Control that could be used to squeeze the amount they are paying out to devs down.
They obviously have some kind of end goal in mind, and that end goal is most likely not "continue spending huge amounts of money securing games for Game Pass indefinitely, way more than the net amount we receive from subscribers".
This is how it is for me, plus it has reignited co-op gaming here too as we each have the same games available to play.
Exactly. All the people that ask 'How is this sustainable, I'm only paying $10 for months/years' are only taking into account the top 1-2% of the market that are here as opposed to the wider market who were barely aware of the extent of introductory gamepass offers and are probably already on full price subs they are very unlikely to cancel any time soon.
Difference is 1st party day one release on Game Pass. It's like Microsoft no longer has any use for software sales even for their own games.
I mean first party games tend to just primarily be vehicles to get you into their ecosystem. So they slap em on game pass for the double buy-in. You bought their console and potentially you also bought into game pass.
The catch is you can't play as Spiderman in one game. /s
In all seriousness it's the Netflix way of having good deals early on so people rave about and they get good word of mouth. Which isn't a bad thing in the moment but at some point the music stops and we wake up in a corporate ecosystem that you're ambivalent about. If I had an Xbox I'd have jumped into it though sounds like a good deal.
In all seriousness it's the Netflix way of having good deals early on so people rave about and they get good word of mouth. Which isn't a bad thing in the moment but at some point the music stops and we wake up in a corporate ecosystem that you're ambivalent about. If I had an Xbox I'd have jumped into it though sounds like a good deal.
I think you can get Xbox Live Gold and then convert it to Game Pass Ultimate. Will double the subscription time too. Soo if you have a month of Gold, it will convert to 2 months of Game Pass Ultimate.
The catch is that eventually your "trial" period will run out and while there will absolutely be deals on the service, you'll likely have to pay either $10 or $15 a month for Gamepass once your existing sub runs out.
The question is will the 20-30 months most people have on their converted sub (assuming most people subbed currently bought 3 years of gold then converted to GPU during last E3) be enough time to truly prove to those gamers that staying subbed at full price is worth it? I mean, for me, even at $180 a year, I'll be happy because I know I'll likely get my money's worth out of it. But I know that I am not most gamers, so I guess it's all dependent on MS's 2021 GP output and their output the first half of 2022.
The idea is that it's much easier to join than it is to leave, even when prices increase. Also, having the super cheap deals (which isn't even as cheap as the $1 figure everyone says) is something that convinces a lot of people to subscribe, hence 10 million subs less than 3 years (I think) after the service launched, and "unprecedented growth" this last quarter for GP subs (though no figure of what that growth actually is)
The question is will the 20-30 months most people have on their converted sub (assuming most people subbed currently bought 3 years of gold then converted to GPU during last E3) be enough time to truly prove to those gamers that staying subbed at full price is worth it? I mean, for me, even at $180 a year, I'll be happy because I know I'll likely get my money's worth out of it. But I know that I am not most gamers, so I guess it's all dependent on MS's 2021 GP output and their output the first half of 2022.
The idea is that it's much easier to join than it is to leave, even when prices increase. Also, having the super cheap deals (which isn't even as cheap as the $1 figure everyone says) is something that convinces a lot of people to subscribe, hence 10 million subs less than 3 years (I think) after the service launched, and "unprecedented growth" this last quarter for GP subs (though no figure of what that growth actually is)
Can there be some semblance of this actually occurring before being used as a possible outcome? Cause mostly what we hear now is the oppositte of your scenario. People who are subbed to gamepass are still buying games. I'm one of them.
There's no catch, just keep enjoying the amazing service OP cos it is only going to get better. :)
The catch is things rotate so you have to be ready and able to play the game on game pass that you want to play. A few times a game has rotated off of Game Pass and I ended up buying it anyway. Not only that but they plan on keeping people subbed for years like Netflix so you're going to pay that $15 a month or whatever for years. I don't know about you but maybe aside from Gears 5, I can't think of an Xbox game that I would have paid $60 for over the past few years.
OP
OP
I have not bought a xbox game since gamepass (maybe i mightve but i cant remember and it would be some very cheap high discounted game). As is i already have too much games to play, gamepass alone.
Whatever it takes, like becoming the Ghost instead of a honorable Samurai or like buying exclusivity in games ala Sony. They all must try different things to get ahead. I bet Sony wouldn't be as cutthroat if MS wasn't also being aggressive. Competition is great.
Ha, good point! I often forget all about Now.
Pretty much this. We're already starting to see this with Halo Infinite having a full single player campaign instead of traditional game design decisions like having an exclusive paid DLC Class in a game.
Not really though. I dont play multiplayer nor ftp games and I've played plenty on gamepass. Recently finished A plague Tale, The Messenger and playing Gato Roboto. Cross Code and Carrion are next.
User Banned (3 Days) - Console Warring
The catch is that you still have to pay $60 to get the really good exclusives on PS5 and Switch.
Every platform has a honey moon period where the service seems too good to be true and then slowly but surely the quality of the service decreases as the profit margins for the platform holder are raised. At some point it has to recoup the money that it is burning right now to catch people. Remember when EVERYTHING was on Netflix while it was cheap. Now we need many more streaming platforms to have access to all kinds of things.
If you play on PC, the catch in my case was I can't get my fucking 100GB back on my SSD because MS won't give me permissions under any circumstances*. PC game pass still has a ton of issues. Also, from my own perspective, it feels like a culmination of GAAS, and that is the ultimate endgame for this sort of service - ie (almost) everything is super long (or super short) GAAS/dlc/microtransation-laden.
* Before anyone mentions it, no, the fixes don't always work, and in this case it looks like it needs nothing short of a format.
* Before anyone mentions it, no, the fixes don't always work, and in this case it looks like it needs nothing short of a format.
None of those are MS games. The majority of their games (Halo, Gears, Forza, etc) include microtransactions and/or lootboxes in some form, though they've obviously been doing this since before game pass.
If you currently do not have an Ultimate subscription then you just need to buy three years of Gold and apply them then upgrade to Gamepass Ultimate.
The catch is is that it increases your spending. If we take PS4 attach rates as a realistic estimate (I think the XBOXs are a bit lower), consumers buy on average, 2-3 games per year, and those games aren't consistently at full cost.
Gamepass has you paying $10 a month, $120 per year, to play a what is realistically, only a small selection of games on the service. While the sum total of the games in the service offers obvious value, it's additional to the average spend. Further, the games on game pass don't even necessarily overlap with the games that those people would be buying, as many titles from third parties don't hit the service, at least not around their launch window.
So as a result, I suspect for the lay consumer it often increases their household spend, without necessarily seeing them engage with much more content on their system.
I know that's been the case for me and my partner. I like having game pass ultimate, and I downloaded maybe 30 games with good intentions to play them, but I've actually only played Sunset Overdrive, Forza Horizon 4, Halo Anniversary Ori 2 and Crack Down 3. I would have never bought Crack Down 3, and frankly I didn't enjoy the time I spent with it. My girlfriend enjoyed Ori though I haven't played it, I like Forza Horizon 4 a lot, and I've also been enjoying Halo Anniversary. So that's a sum total of two or three games that I can say we would have paid for.
The big caveat on top of that, is that with gamepass I don't even own those games.
It's the same with Playstation Now. I have a Playstation Now subscription and frankly, despite criticism I think it offers just about as much value as game pass. I recently downloaded WRC8 from there and I've been enjoying that, as an example. But it's rare that I really engage with content here. I browse and download games here and there, in my head I appreciate the variety, the idea that these services will help me keep myself entertained when I don't know what to play, but at the end of the day, I don't think I get a tonne of value from them. Especially when compared to buying games in sales, or buying used games.
It's all just about increasing household spend at the end of the day, and the up front value of these services (both game pass and PS Now) is technically, rather astonishing, but it's encouraging spending that I wouldn't have otherwise undertaken, and at the end of it, it leaves me with nothing to show for it.
Writing this all down makes me think I should just cancel my subscriptions and buy the games that I really enjoy on these services... but the idea of shelling out £100, that's a hard pill to swallow compared to letting them roll over for another month... or another year... and in my mind, I think... what if they add something I want to play next month? At the end of the day it's not a lot of money so it's easy to let it slide, but I think these types of services don't truly offer good value for the average consumer.
Gamepass has you paying $10 a month, $120 per year, to play a what is realistically, only a small selection of games on the service. While the sum total of the games in the service offers obvious value, it's additional to the average spend. Further, the games on game pass don't even necessarily overlap with the games that those people would be buying, as many titles from third parties don't hit the service, at least not around their launch window.
So as a result, I suspect for the lay consumer it often increases their household spend, without necessarily seeing them engage with much more content on their system.
I know that's been the case for me and my partner. I like having game pass ultimate, and I downloaded maybe 30 games with good intentions to play them, but I've actually only played Sunset Overdrive, Forza Horizon 4, Halo Anniversary Ori 2 and Crack Down 3. I would have never bought Crack Down 3, and frankly I didn't enjoy the time I spent with it. My girlfriend enjoyed Ori though I haven't played it, I like Forza Horizon 4 a lot, and I've also been enjoying Halo Anniversary. So that's a sum total of two or three games that I can say we would have paid for.
The big caveat on top of that, is that with gamepass I don't even own those games.
It's the same with Playstation Now. I have a Playstation Now subscription and frankly, despite criticism I think it offers just about as much value as game pass. I recently downloaded WRC8 from there and I've been enjoying that, as an example. But it's rare that I really engage with content here. I browse and download games here and there, in my head I appreciate the variety, the idea that these services will help me keep myself entertained when I don't know what to play, but at the end of the day, I don't think I get a tonne of value from them. Especially when compared to buying games in sales, or buying used games.
It's all just about increasing household spend at the end of the day, and the up front value of these services (both game pass and PS Now) is technically, rather astonishing, but it's encouraging spending that I wouldn't have otherwise undertaken, and at the end of it, it leaves me with nothing to show for it.
Writing this all down makes me think I should just cancel my subscriptions and buy the games that I really enjoy on these services... but the idea of shelling out £100, that's a hard pill to swallow compared to letting them roll over for another month... or another year... and in my mind, I think... what if they add something I want to play next month? At the end of the day it's not a lot of money so it's easy to let it slide, but I think these types of services don't truly offer good value for the average consumer.
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The economics of an all-you-can-eat buffet Xbox Game Pass may be complex, but is understandable.
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You linked me to twitter mentions when I'm talking about devs who have been on gamepass have expressed pleasure with their increased sales and/or engagement. Rockstar released GTA5 on gamepass and then later on Red Dead 2. I don't think they'd put Red Dead on the service if they were getting negative data from GTA5. I really don't. Gamepass isn't cannibalizing things they way some keep trying to paint it.
The catch is it's a loss leading business model atm. They're giving it away, chasing large scale adoption.
There will be a point where MS need it to hit a certain number, and the service will change if it doesn't happen. If it does happen, the industry will change.
Still TBD what the eventual effects of large scale adoption will bring.
There will be a point where MS need it to hit a certain number, and the service will change if it doesn't happen. If it does happen, the industry will change.
Still TBD what the eventual effects of large scale adoption will bring.
Do you really think GTA5 and RDR2 are typical games that are representative of the entire industry?
Edit: and "Some games have been on Game Pass and it seems to have been successful for the developer" is not a very strong argument against the idea that games which are denied the chance to be on Game Pass might find it harder to succeed on Xbox going forward.
Edit2: Come to think about it, I was talking about games that are not on game pass, don't have a significant marketing budget, and aren't from a well known IP. Which of these do you think applies to two games on Game Pass, that have had massive marketing budgets, and are two of the most well known gaming intellectual properties of the last decade?
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The catch is the mass market that will sign up for it based on word of mouth from us saying how awesome it (it is), but pay the monthly fee instead of seeking out deals like we did.
And now more people are in their ecosystem.
And now more people are in their ecosystem.
Yep, if casuals sign on and pay the $15 a month, they will be spending more per year than usual, most likely. Kind of like Netflix, I never used to buy movies so now instead of renting a movie 1-2 times a month for a total of $6 a month I am paying $14(I think) per month for a service I barely use. Cable tv has been a rip off for decades, we don't keep any of that content either. We are conditioned to be subscribers of things that are really draining our bank accounts little by little so we brush it off cause we may use it more someday and we're still living comfortably. It also reminds me of Planet Fitness' business model. Super cheap per month so when people stop going they keep the membership just in case and the price makes for A LOT of members. That's what MS wants.
For me, Game Pass was a steal since I upgraded for $1 until 2023 but once they start charging monthly, I will keep it since it is cheap and there will always be a game or 2 coming up that makes it seem worth it. I also have a lot of time to play games so I really think it is worth it to me but not for most. On the other hand the last few months I've played TLOU2 and Ghost of Tshushima so those $30(if I were paying $15 monthly) would have been a waste. It really depends on how often the 1st party devs crank out games and what third party games come to the service.
You're right here. I know 4 other people on Game Pass, me and a gamer friend are the only two who knew about and took the deal of upgrading, the other 3 are paying month to month.
The catch is they've got you hooked. The conversion deals aren't forever. Though, if you ask me, by the time those deals all expire the selection is looking mighty fine. I'm still blown away that every game shown at July 23rd event is on there.
They were smart to limit you to 3 years prepaid, or else I'd have 10 years of ultimate by now. There is something reassuring about knowing you could not spend another dime for the next 3 years and always have something to play. But of course I'm gonna buy games too.
When it's no longer in beta :) And hopefully by then, the store experience is better. Definitely some growing pains there, and some silly decisions.
They were smart to limit you to 3 years prepaid, or else I'd have 10 years of ultimate by now. There is something reassuring about knowing you could not spend another dime for the next 3 years and always have something to play. But of course I'm gonna buy games too.
When it's no longer in beta :) And hopefully by then, the store experience is better. Definitely some growing pains there, and some silly decisions.
thanks for the laugh
Yep. Since MS Rewards is a thing, and the Gears 5 Rockstar can trick, I've got codes to sub through 11/2023 right now. MS Rewards has also paid off my XSX (as long as it comes in at $500+tax).
Some people might spend more money in the ecosystem, but I sure don't. I spend more time gaming, though.
The catch is that other people will be funding my gaming habits because I'm set for next-gen and I didn't spend a dime.
Some people might spend more money in the ecosystem, but I sure don't. I spend more time gaming, though.
The catch is that other people will be funding my gaming habits because I'm set for next-gen and I didn't spend a dime.
