-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
-
We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.
Just finished the game and have some questions:
- Why does getting in a Sentinel cause them to "log out" from the virtual world into the real world? What makes it this way?
- The creation of the Sentinels. I only remember bits and pieces about it before the scene where Okino said that they don't have a cockpit when he designed them originally.
I vaguely remember him mentioned before that he was not involved that much with the 1st gen which was apparently Ida's design, if I'm not mistaken.
There is also a part in one of the file that said something along the line of it was Izumi who made the mobile factory gave birth to the Sentinels.
I remember them mentioned that the Sentinels start out as being remotely controlled or part autonomous and Gouto took control of 10 of them alone or something before they got taken by Kaijus so they decided to switch to manually control them from the inside but I don't know what they did after that. Did Okino (or someone else because Okino said it like he doesn't know anything about that) designed the cockpit that is somehow identical to the growth pod. Was there even an actual cockpit inside the Sentinels? I assumed there is because I remember seeing Morimura inside one (fully-clothed so it's not the pod). Did the game say something about this or is it just a matter of Universal Control made it so lol. A breakdown of the whole Sentinels creation process would be nice.
- Not really a serious question but I find it funny that while it makes sense why they are naked inside the pod, they somehow still have glasses and hair ornaments lol. Heck, Shinonome is even covered in bandages and Miura somehow has a scar he got from a procedure inside the simulation. Is this the case where nanomachine tricked them into seeing those things (but not their cloth for some reason) so that they don't find dissonance between real and virtual world? I assumed it's like this mostly for the player perspective so that the visual don't give away too much and don't have much in-universe explanation.
- Why does getting in a Sentinel cause them to "log out" from the virtual world into the real world? What makes it this way?
- The creation of the Sentinels. I only remember bits and pieces about it before the scene where Okino said that they don't have a cockpit when he designed them originally.
I vaguely remember him mentioned before that he was not involved that much with the 1st gen which was apparently Ida's design, if I'm not mistaken.
There is also a part in one of the file that said something along the line of it was Izumi who made the mobile factory gave birth to the Sentinels.
I remember them mentioned that the Sentinels start out as being remotely controlled or part autonomous and Gouto took control of 10 of them alone or something before they got taken by Kaijus so they decided to switch to manually control them from the inside but I don't know what they did after that. Did Okino (or someone else because Okino said it like he doesn't know anything about that) designed the cockpit that is somehow identical to the growth pod. Was there even an actual cockpit inside the Sentinels? I assumed there is because I remember seeing Morimura inside one (fully-clothed so it's not the pod). Did the game say something about this or is it just a matter of Universal Control made it so lol. A breakdown of the whole Sentinels creation process would be nice.
- Not really a serious question but I find it funny that while it makes sense why they are naked inside the pod, they somehow still have glasses and hair ornaments lol. Heck, Shinonome is even covered in bandages and Miura somehow has a scar he got from a procedure inside the simulation. Is this the case where nanomachine tricked them into seeing those things (but not their cloth for some reason) so that they don't find dissonance between real and virtual world? I assumed it's like this mostly for the player perspective so that the visual don't give away too much and don't have much in-universe explanation.
There's no strict order. There isn't any real missable content either. Just play in the order you feel like and you will eventually find a wall in each character story, which will prevent you from seeing things you're not supposed to yet and encourage you to read other character's story.
Well, beat the game saw it all and came to check out what era has been talking about for awhile. It did turn out better than I expected. When I first started the game I was pretty disinterested. After about half way through it, I couldn't put it down.
I just finished this game. Thought it had a good plot and said plot was provided in a fun/unique way but the story overall ended up feeling flat. Too many of the themes presented by the plot are never explored or confronted by the characters. A lot of the character relationships at the end also felt weak and contrived. I might go post more about this later because the idea of story vs. plot in this game is interesting to me but overall, I'd give it a B to a B+, a score elevated a solid two points by
Hijiyama and Okino's relationship which I expected to be disappointed and even offended by how Atlus would handle it but came away feeling really happy.
Finally finished the game this morning. I'm definitely going to have to read a Wiki or something, because the story lost me pretty hard towards the end. I think I understood most of what happened? But I was pretty confused towards the end.
I don't dislike the story of this game, per se, but it definitely didn't hold my interest the same way most visual novel stories do. The 13 stories all felt so disconnected from one another for a while, and the characters weren't really well defined, they just didn't feel real or relatable to me. None of the big reveals were dropped in a way that has the gravity of something like the Zero Escape trilogy.
I actually have the opposite opinion of seemingly most people as I thought the strategy sections were pretty tight. My biggest problems with RTS games are that I don't like the "building" phases because it seems like you're planning for shit that's too far in the future to conceptualize, and that doing on-the-fly strategizing can be difficult to keep track of in my head (well, along with the fact that playing them feels like doing schoolwork to me for some reason). None of those issues are present in 13 Sentinels, and the way the combat pauses when you get into menuing for a character makes it not even really feel like an RTS game. There wasn't a lot of nuance to the system, but it was definitely pretty satisfying blowing shit up.
I don't dislike the story of this game, per se, but it definitely didn't hold my interest the same way most visual novel stories do. The 13 stories all felt so disconnected from one another for a while, and the characters weren't really well defined, they just didn't feel real or relatable to me. None of the big reveals were dropped in a way that has the gravity of something like the Zero Escape trilogy.
I actually have the opposite opinion of seemingly most people as I thought the strategy sections were pretty tight. My biggest problems with RTS games are that I don't like the "building" phases because it seems like you're planning for shit that's too far in the future to conceptualize, and that doing on-the-fly strategizing can be difficult to keep track of in my head (well, along with the fact that playing them feels like doing schoolwork to me for some reason). None of those issues are present in 13 Sentinels, and the way the combat pauses when you get into menuing for a character makes it not even really feel like an RTS game. There wasn't a lot of nuance to the system, but it was definitely pretty satisfying blowing shit up.
Finished the game yesterday. Graphics are beautiful. The RTS-style sections grew on me after being somewhat ambivalent to them initially, probably because I didn't quite understand how to play or which strategies to use. The interface at times got a little confusing with so many enemies at the same time, especially in the final level, as at times I couldn't recognize the Kaiju creating shields for the others. In any case, it was definitely good fun.
Now on the story: it hooked me like few games have, probably because it's very good and told in an interesting manner. That I am a sucker for these kind of sci-fi only adds up. I liked how the game slowly peeled back, but at the same time gave you hints here and there so you could see it coming:
Reading this thread has been quite helpful in clearing up some of the stuff, honestly speaking during the story I hadn't quite understood the Izumi-Morimura dynamics, and the fact that they came from two loops ago, or what part of them transferred to the next loop. Also, what I didn't quite get was what 2188 Chihiro Morimura planned all along, and why she didn't want to help them initially. Also, who was affected by the DD-426? Only Shinomone and Sekigahara? Do they actually recover for the final battle?
I would have also liked to see a bit more details on what transpired in 2187-2188. My understanding is that Chihiro Morimura recreated Kengo Ogata as an AI shortly after he died, presumably because he was some sort of mentor to her, while 2188 Renya Gouto wanted to pull the plug on her research. On Kengo's advice (because he wanted to be revived), she sold the nanomachines in the black market, but it's implied that this led to an infection that effectively wiped out humanity. This led to the 15 exiles in the satellite, and after 2188 Sekigahara murders Morimura and the bomb severely damages their living space, they end up killing each other (that part is also left without many details, perhaps understandably so). What's not quite clear is what 2188 Tetsuya Ida does to disappoint Shinonome, and I don't quite get how Project Ark survives the explosion and goes on for millions of years.
Now on the story: it hooked me like few games have, probably because it's very good and told in an interesting manner. That I am a sucker for these kind of sci-fi only adds up. I liked how the game slowly peeled back, but at the same time gave you hints here and there so you could see it coming:
- The different years being referred to as sectors already told you that it was not time travel what was going on, besides the fact that 1945 getting destroyed had no impact on 1985. There's also the initial conversation between 2188 Keitaro Miura and Tamao Kurabe talking about recreating their old house, which in hindsight makes lots of sense (and the fact that this event comes first in the Analysis section).
- Okino's comments on 80% of the innerlocitor's computing being devoted to a process he didn't know. Also, Tamao Kurabe's body disappearing after dying in 1945
- The Kaiju not being aliens
- Kyuta Shiba not interacting with anyone
Reading this thread has been quite helpful in clearing up some of the stuff, honestly speaking during the story I hadn't quite understood the Izumi-Morimura dynamics, and the fact that they came from two loops ago, or what part of them transferred to the next loop. Also, what I didn't quite get was what 2188 Chihiro Morimura planned all along, and why she didn't want to help them initially. Also, who was affected by the DD-426? Only Shinomone and Sekigahara? Do they actually recover for the final battle?
I would have also liked to see a bit more details on what transpired in 2187-2188. My understanding is that Chihiro Morimura recreated Kengo Ogata as an AI shortly after he died, presumably because he was some sort of mentor to her, while 2188 Renya Gouto wanted to pull the plug on her research. On Kengo's advice (because he wanted to be revived), she sold the nanomachines in the black market, but it's implied that this led to an infection that effectively wiped out humanity. This led to the 15 exiles in the satellite, and after 2188 Sekigahara murders Morimura and the bomb severely damages their living space, they end up killing each other (that part is also left without many details, perhaps understandably so). What's not quite clear is what 2188 Tetsuya Ida does to disappoint Shinonome, and I don't quite get how Project Ark survives the explosion and goes on for millions of years.
Last edited:
Well, Kenjo Ogata in AI form is the one who pushes 2188 Chihiro to sell nanomachines to fund his Project Ark, hence he's the person who sets the whole chain that wipes out humanity because he wants to live again. I am guessing his AI is sort of lost in the whole mess that goes on in the satellite, but I also assume that he might have been envisioned to play a bigger role.
It is mentioned that Okino borrrows code from an existing videogame to create the simulation, that game being part of a simulation to defend earth against an invasion. He removes the part where the Kaiju come in, but later on 2188 Shinonome adds it up after becoming disillusioned with Ida and humanity killing each other to the last survivor. Hence, it was not intended, it's 2188 Ryoko's doing to sabotage the program.
Then, the program begins after terraforming a suitable planets. Is is mentioned at some points that a large number of loops have happened, and given that they were orbiting the new Earth already one can assume that this is where the whole thing was getting bottlenecked because of 2188 Ryoko's actions. So no, what took millions of years was the process to find a suitable planet and terraform it, the process of raising them was "merely" a few thousand years.
I think most stuff makes sense within the internal logic that the game sets, IMO.
Just beat it and loved it. Now I'm trying to find some info into things I'm not clear about or might be plot holes.
Right now what I want to know is how they brought the simulation back to a pre-kaiju state when it was stated that Sector 0 was at its absolute limit and no other resets would be supported. Did Ida's consciousness actually found a way to restore it years down the line, meaning his plan would have worked? But then I struggle to see how that would be possible with Aegis fully in place.
Right now what I want to know is how they brought the simulation back to a pre-kaiju state when it was stated that Sector 0 was at its absolute limit and no other resets would be supported. Did Ida's consciousness actually found a way to restore it years down the line, meaning his plan would have worked? But then I struggle to see how that would be possible with Aegis fully in place.
Up to now, the simulation restarted every 16 years due to the sabotage, causing loops to be possible. However, the pod facility which houses the sectors, including sector 0, has an expiration date of about 5000 years, as per the ingame wiki. Should this be exceeded, it must be remade as well, including sector 0. I guess the implication is that this would wipe sector 0's memory. Maybe the required AI data would be pulled again from the satellite when remaking sector 0? In any case, it wouldn't include the backed up data from the last two loops, thus reverting the situation to how it was before two loops ago. That is, another freak occurrence such as characters discovering "the UFO" and accidentally uploading themselves to sector 0 would be required.
Since the simulation was aborted, the facility and thus sector 0 never got rebuilt, and so all the data remained stored there until a few years later when the characters were able to access it and restart the simulation.
So basically the simulation presumably stayed on the post-kaiju attack state for all the years the survivors were in outside world until they (again the survivors) found a way to reset the simulation without it falling apart? Or is aborting a different process?
I don't think they quite explain how that works, or maybe I didn't pay enough attention, but I think it's assumed that after they wake up they start developing and it's likely that they eventually manage to bring back the simulation to the state it was before the Kaiju invasion.
I suppose that makes sense if we extrapolate. I don't think this was explained, but it's an acceptable deduction.
Here's another question: did setting the sectors to different timelines spread across three centuries serve any purpose? If anything those further on the past would have to deal with a massive technological gap and play a catch-up game to XXII century tech much more than the others living on more futuristic timelines. Not to mention the kids being raised in 1945 would have been brought up under a fascist-nationalistic government.
I remember Sekigahara (I think it was him) saying he had a fascination with World War II-era Japan which is why that period was created. But as far as the others beyond where most of the game takes place (1985, 2025), I don't think there was much of a reason other than continuing 40 years leaps a few more times.
I remember the scene, it was Miura. But I don't see why they needed simulations of different times to begin with, unless they didn't and Miura being the designer of those scenarios just did what he wanted. But then nobody would have brought up the same points I did above?
I think it was mentioned that they couldn't agree on what culture to instill in them, so they chose multiple. The goal of the simulation was to instill "good" human culture in them, before humanity became too bad/corrupt and killed themselves with nanomachines and mind manipulation. I think it's a pretty interesting thought experiment actually, if you wanted to restart human culture from a certain point in time, which point would you choose? Could we agree on what the golden era or most noble era of humanity was?
This actually makes sense. But someone thought Imperial Japan was that? They should have left room in that station for a historian...
I might be misremembering since it's been so long now, but wasn't there some dialogue explicitly calling out how a war nation had some value for instilling purpose into its people or something? Something about not growing up during times of peace?
Honestly I think it's just that Vanillaware wanted WW2 because it's iconic so to speak, it's more a set-piece than anything. Neither Miura or Hijiyama act like they grew up during a fascist regime and Tamao is one of the most sweet characters in the game. Plus 1945 would be so removed from someone in 2188 they may not even think of the implications.
I don't think the game is like super deep in term of character and some things probably got muddled by the NA translation and the cultural differences, but in term of execution the route is mostly fine, despite the cuts and the changes at the last minute (AI Hijiyama, Okino character got changed a bit after the initial positive reception in the demo iirc)
It the end is a sci-fi existentialism coming of age about how much our genes define us (And the game answer seem to be a bit but not to the point they define us), Hijiyama's route is like totally acceptable for what I think the author was going for and it's also pretty much unique in term of execution (I can't really think of another game of the same genre where two guys are canonically stated to be in love with each other and they are both alive and not evil)
Okino and Hijiyama pretty much plays on the idea of reincarnations romance, which is probably not super know in the west but anyone familiar with it will immediately pick on the trope after the 2188 log and it's also one of the themes of one of the manga that inspired 13S (Thought Iori's route is the one that is directly inspired by it). And I mean, no one got cloned irl but I assume the clones of two gay dudes would still be gay lol. I think also most of 2188 characters felt like "Props" for the clones more than anything (Looking at the official guides there is even barely any info about them) and give further context to their actions. Except Chihiro cuz it's literally her 2188 version.
I don't think the game is like super deep in term of character and some things probably got muddled by the NA translation and the cultural differences, but in term of execution the route is mostly fine, despite the cuts and the changes at the last minute (AI Hijiyama, Okino character got changed a bit after the initial positive reception in the demo iirc)
It the end is a sci-fi existentialism coming of age about how much our genes define us (And the game answer seem to be a bit but not to the point they define us), Hijiyama's route is like totally acceptable for what I think the author was going for and it's also pretty much unique in term of execution (I can't really think of another game of the same genre where two guys are canonically stated to be in love with each other and they are both alive and not evil)
Last edited:
I've been meaning to write in this thread ever since I registered here, heh.
This damn game has one of the most mind-blowing stories I've ever experienced. It is amazing, pure ingenuity. I'm so impressed that the devs actually manage to keep track of everything.
That being said, I have some questions. It took me virtually forever to figure out Morimura, not to mention Izumi and 426, and all the loops. I have it all nailed down now, which took a loooooot of datalog pouring.
The thing I still can't wrap my head around, is Miyuki Inaba and Bj. From what I've understood, some of the compatible has Sentinel AI backups, and among them is Kisaragi and Miura. But I'm kinda stumped after that ... I guess Bj is Miura's AI backup, and he's running around with all the logs? But why does Inaba have the ability to be outside universal control? And how come Amiguchi could just be ejected out of it by her?
Why does specifically Kisaragi and Miura have prominent AI backups running around in the story? Was it because of that shifter explosion incident that android Kisaragi mentioned? Did they end up in Sector 0 somehow?
This damn game has one of the most mind-blowing stories I've ever experienced. It is amazing, pure ingenuity. I'm so impressed that the devs actually manage to keep track of everything.
That being said, I have some questions. It took me virtually forever to figure out Morimura, not to mention Izumi and 426, and all the loops. I have it all nailed down now, which took a loooooot of datalog pouring.
The thing I still can't wrap my head around, is Miyuki Inaba and Bj. From what I've understood, some of the compatible has Sentinel AI backups, and among them is Kisaragi and Miura. But I'm kinda stumped after that ... I guess Bj is Miura's AI backup, and he's running around with all the logs? But why does Inaba have the ability to be outside universal control? And how come Amiguchi could just be ejected out of it by her?
Why does specifically Kisaragi and Miura have prominent AI backups running around in the story? Was it because of that shifter explosion incident that android Kisaragi mentioned? Did they end up in Sector 0 somehow?
Iirc during one of the previous loops they tried to upload Kisaragi, Miura and Hijiyama and Tamao in Sector Zero, but there was an explosion (The one 426 got blamed for, but he had nothing to do with it) in the last moment and their data was broken, so they couldn't become proper AI/NPCs like Ida and Morimura. Ida recovered the back ups and created the AI.
Inaba ended up in the safelite by a stroke of luck, when Morimura ejected everyone in the last moment of the Kaiju invasion, and she got warped there.
Inaba ended up in the safelite by a stroke of luck, when Morimura ejected everyone in the last moment of the Kaiju invasion, and she got warped there.
Last edited:
Played it, enjoyed it, beat it, but felt kind of iffy on the story at some point. It started off strong, but I feel a bit tired about the "it's the Matrix !" trope. At that point I felt there was nothing tangible at stake anymore.
The adventure and gameplay parts felt a bit too disjointed. It would've been better to have mandatory battles regularly after VN segments, like the prologue.
Battles were pretty fun though.
Really enjoyed some characters arcs, such as Ogata's or Kurabe's. Felt Shinonome was among the weakest.
All in all a good game, but not the best VN/mecha game I've ever played.
The adventure and gameplay parts felt a bit too disjointed. It would've been better to have mandatory battles regularly after VN segments, like the prologue.
Battles were pretty fun though.
Really enjoyed some characters arcs, such as Ogata's or Kurabe's. Felt Shinonome was among the weakest.
All in all a good game, but not the best VN/mecha game I've ever played.