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ColonelForbin

Member
Oct 28, 2017
601
The more I hear about this the more I realize it's going to crash and burn. So many other, better options. Is there a market for this? Probably, but I just can't imagine a very big one. Now, if google had bought Sony or Microsoft then we would be having a different discussion.
 

thebishop

Banned
Nov 10, 2017
2,758
I dont think mobile gamers / the more casual crowd really care enough, or get the appeal, to deem it a better experience. Otherwise all of them would buy controllers for their phones.
Im not talking about the mobile/casual crowd. Literally what if playing on Stadia in your livingroom is better than a PS5 by all the parameters you care about?
 

Kyougar

Cute Animal Whisperer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
9,359
Im not talking about the mobile/casual crowd. Literally what if playing on Stadia in your livingroom is better than a PS5 by all the parameters you care about?

And what exactly does this magical streaming service provide?
Where do you get the controller? How much is the controller?
Do we know if a fraction of third parties are even onboard or do we get a WiiU third-parties situation without any exclusives?
We are still on the narrative that exclusives make or break a system, what does Stadia have on exclusives?
 

Nateo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,547
It's there in a lot of places. My friend just moved to rural VA and the lowest cable internet tier was 250Mbs.
Internet Speed is only 1 minor mesurement in this. Stability is key and a lot of places still suffer from congestion and no doubt ISP's will soon start limiting speeds on this streaming service like they have all others at some point.
 

piratethingy

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,428
Im not talking about the mobile/casual crowd. Literally what if playing on Stadia in your livingroom is better than a PS5 by all the parameters you care about?

My PC is already better than my PS4 by every paramater I care about, but the PS4 is still plugged in because it plays Bloodborne.

Now hypothetically Google could make exclusives of that quality happen but it seems really unlikely given what it would cost and the time required.
 

Pancakes R Us

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,345
Don't pay a fee and get 1080p but pay full price for games or pay a monthly fee and also full price for games but get up to 4K resolution.

It just doesn't sound very appealing to me. I'd rather pay full console price and be able to play my shit offline if I want to. Plus streaming 4K at 60fps is going to require a monster connection which would cost a fortune over here in the UK.
I pay £23/month for super fast fibre, get 70mb down. Should be fine for it and doesn't cost a fortune.
 

dunkzilla

alt account
Banned
Dec 13, 2018
4,762
I genuinely don't know what's hard to understand about Stadia. What Google have actually said is really easy to follow
 

Raonak

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
2,170
Oh wow... I didnt realise this was a full game purchase model....

this seems so fucking risky to invest in.
like I can always guarantee that 90% of my PS4 games will be playable forever.

In stadia you will always need a decent internet connection, and the hope that google keeps this service up forever...

Not to mention you're massively limiting your games selection.
You don't get either sony's exclusives, or ms's exclusives. It's basically just a 3rd party box.
 
Last edited:

piratethingy

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,428
I genuinely don't know what's hard to understand about Stadia. What Google have actually said is really easy to follow

Who's confused? Just read the entire second page and no one seems confused at all. People can be baffled by decisions and still fully understand a situation.
 

Musubi

Unshakable Resolve - Prophet of Truth
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
23,611
They took the shittest aspect of console gaming which is the mandatory online tax and say that's what they're going for like that's supposed to be a good thing. Do they think people like having to sub to PS+? Ha ha.

They want to have their cake and eat it with both the sub model and the per unit model at the same time. To be fair I can't even blame them considering the crazy shit gamers have shown they are willing to pay for. I'm sure many people will sign up for this crazy scheme.

I don't know how many times this has to be said but... YOU. DON'T. HAVE. TO. SUBSCRIBE. TO. ANYTHING.
 

Fredrik

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,003
Instant library was a huge selling point towards establishing Playstation Plus as something worth paying for in the PS3 era.
Huh? I never subbed but I always thought it was like it is today, that you had to grow your library of "free" games by subscribing to the service. I certainly didn't have a library of games when I subbed on PS4 at least.
 

Fredrik

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,003
They took the shittest aspect of console gaming which is the mandatory online tax
No they didn't, online gaming is free.
The subscription service is about 4K streaming, 5.1 sound and "free" games that grows your library like on PS+ and XBL. $10/month
1080p, stereo sound, online, is all free. $0/month
 

TaySan

SayTan
Member
Dec 10, 2018
31,452
Tulsa, Oklahoma
I would be onboard with this if their was an option to play my games locally alongside streaming that would be an insane value. Like Steam
 

Aokiji

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,265
Los Angeles
Nobody can answer who this service is for. What gamer is going to pay $60 for a new game to only be able to stream it? mind you their objective here is to get paying costumers, the $10 sub. what gamer has 4K screens in his home and is paying $60 for games that doesn't already have a console or gaming PC?
 

Musubi

Unshakable Resolve - Prophet of Truth
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
23,611
You do need to subscribe in 2019.

The free tier as well as a ton of other features aren't coming before 2020. It's very much a soft launch this year.

You do have to get a founders pack but you again... don't have to sub to anything. Once you get your founders code and your in you are in. They are even giving away buddy passes for people to give to their friends to create accounts.
 

Fredrik

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,003
I would be onboard with this if their was an option to play my games locally alongside streaming that would be an insane value. Like Steam
Playing locally won't happen unless they start selling the Stadia hardware as regular consoles. Which is unthinkable since that would defeat their whole idea that we shouldn't have to worry about a box, loading times, installs, Pro/X upgrades etc etc.
A dream scenario would be that they made a deal with Valve that games bought on Steam or on Stadia would sync up, both licenses and saves, so you could go back and fourth between the two services, like Play Anywhere with Xbox and Win 10. The best of both worlds.
 

AtomicShroom

Tools & Automation
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
3,079


I swear this is what Google are sounding like to me right now:

3679q1.jpg
 

Primal Sage

Virtually Real
Member
Nov 27, 2017
9,729
I don't get why the first free game you get with a pro subscription is Destiny 2.

It's a free to play game. Their first bonus game... is free on every platform. What a steal! Not exactly setting the bar high now are we?
 

Deleted member 3190

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,214
I don't get why the first free game you get with a pro subscription is Destiny 2.

It's a free to play game. Their first bonus game... is free on every platform. What a steal! Not exactly setting the bar high now are we?
Not saying it was a smart decision, but I think the difference is you will get the paid expansions as well with Stadia Pro.
 

Deleted member 42472

User requested account closure
Banned
Apr 21, 2018
729
Not saying it was a smart decision, but I think the difference is you will get the paid expansions as well with Stadia Pro.

I actually think it is a pretty smart one. Especially if the expansions are treated as DLC on your Bungie account. Just takes one cool new drop or a few influencers playing and you got a bunch of people who will throw down 10 bucks to grab all the expansions and test out Stadia in the process. I know I got Discord Plus for a month because it was a good price on some Warframe loot and platinum

I am not sure if it is the best "game" for a launch month, but if Bungie have Google's back on a content drop it probably is a good one. And if not, Youtube just needs to "accidentally" weight Destiny LPs for a few weeks.


And it acts as the next step for proving the viability of this. Folk (myself included) were shocked that AssCreed played so well, but that is a very slow paced game. Destiny is also a VERY slow paced shooter, but it is something people will think "is too latency sensitive". So if folk try that out they tell their friends and you get even more people saying "Yo, this shit actually sort of kind of works."
 

Fredrik

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,003
Nobody can answer who this service is for. What gamer is going to pay $60 for a new game to only be able to stream it? mind you their objective here is to get paying costumers, the $10 sub. what gamer has 4K screens in his home and is paying $60 for games that doesn't already have a console or gaming PC?
4KTV or not I'd say that the typical customer is someone who aren't usually jumping in on consoles day 1 but maybe year 3 or something because the price of the box is a problem. As for $60 game purchases and streaming I don't see what's the big deal. It's the standard price and streaming shouldn't be an issue, DF tested the Stadia streaming regarding latency and the latency on AC Odyssey was like on the local XB1X version.

Alltough, in this particular case we're essentially getting to sample next gen consoles in 2019, because a 10.7TF AMD speced hardware is pretty much what we can expect, with the stackable hardware and elastic computing thingy as a bonus. So I can imagine that quite a few core gamers will jump in as well to see what it's all about. Like me. The low entry price made it an easy choice for me to jump in. Having to pay $500 for a box and then $60 for each game would've made me much more cautious.
 

thebishop

Banned
Nov 10, 2017
2,758
Whatever the PS5 ends up being will surfice for me tech wise next gen.I'll pop my discs in and also probably buy a fair few digital titles and be good to go.
Simply not interested in streaming games while I have an alternative that I'm far more comfortable with.
I've no idea if Stadia will find an audience but it's got nothing to offer that I want right now.
I'm also old and not from the instant gratification generation,lol............I grew up waiting for 10mins for my C64 cassette games to load,I've no issues waiting for an install.

My first system was the 2600...
 

Deleted member 3190

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,214
I actually think it is a pretty smart one. Especially if the expansions are treated as DLC on your Bungie account. Just takes one cool new drop or a few influencers playing and you got a bunch of people who will throw down 10 bucks to grab all the expansions and test out Stadia in the process. I know I got Discord Plus for a month because it was a good price on some Warframe loot and platinum

I am not sure if it is the best "game" for a launch month, but if Bungie have Google's back on a content drop it probably is a good one. And if not, Youtube just needs to "accidentally" weight Destiny LPs for a few weeks.


And it acts as the next step for proving the viability of this. Folk (myself included) were shocked that AssCreed played so well, but that is a very slow paced game. Destiny is also a VERY slow paced shooter, but it is something people will think "is too latency sensitive". So if folk try that out they tell their friends and you get even more people saying "Yo, this shit actually sort of kind of works."
Oh don't get me wrong, I think all the doom and gloom being thrown around about streaming and Stadia in particular here is ridiculous, but I still think starting with a single game that will have a F2P version available for most other platforms is a mistake.
 

thebishop

Banned
Nov 10, 2017
2,758
And what exactly does this magical streaming service provide?
Where do you get the controller? How much is the controller?
Do we know if a fraction of third parties are even onboard or do we get a WiiU third-parties situation without any exclusives?
We are still on the narrative that exclusives make or break a system, what does Stadia have on exclusives?

Any hid controller is supported on PC/phones. There's also a specialized controller which additionally works with the Chromecast. It costs $70 and for the sake of argument let's assume it's at least sold at google.com, Best buy and Amazon.

Every 3rd party publisher other than Activision is officially on board.

Regarding exclusives, Stadia's 1st party publishing is headed by Jade Raymond who created the Assassin's Creed franchise and then led Ubisoft's division for new IP. Later she worked with Amy Hennig on EA's cancelled Star Wars game. No games have been announced yet.

We also know Google is working with Larian on Baldur's Gate 3.
 

Aokiji

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,265
Los Angeles
4KTV or not I'd say that the typical customer is someone who aren't usually jumping in on consoles day 1 but maybe year 3 or something because the price of the box is a problem. As for $60 game purchases and streaming I don't see what's the big deal. It's the standard price and streaming shouldn't be an issue, DF tested the Stadia streaming regarding latency and the latency on AC Odyssey was like on the local XB1X version.
i mention 4k bc that's the diff between paying and not paying for stadia. 1080p is free. so if youre into 4k and game, 95%+ chance you have a console or pc for that. consoles if we're lucky are $50 cheaper in year 3ish, $100 if we're super lucky. so that's still gonna be like $300+ dollars youre paying for a box. so im not assuming price is why youre not a console gamer. $60 for a stream is 100% a difference and a big deal. streaming working well in tests is far different form when everyone is using it. it's easy to have good tests results. actual performance in a large user situation has not been recorded. and youre paying the same to only be able to stream it. and your ownership is at the behest of stadia working. if stadia is down for anything, you wont have access to your games.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,844
Huh? I never subbed but I always thought it was like it is today, that you had to grow your library of "free" games by subscribing to the service. I certainly didn't have a library of games when I subbed on PS4 at least.
Looking into it further, I thought there was an extensive instant library but it seems it wasn't as vast as I remembered.
At E3 2012, Sony introduced the instant library. You got 10 PS3 games at sign up and then they rotated some out every month as we know the service today.
 

TheDoctor

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,264
You do have to get a founders pack but you again... don't have to sub to anything. Once you get your founders code and your in you are in. They are even giving away buddy passes for people to give to their friends to create accounts.
Those Buddy Passes won't be available at launch.

The only way to try out Stadia this year, is to either buy the $129 Founder's Edition (which includes a 3 month Pro trial code) or pay $9.99 for the monthly subscription.
 

IamFlying

Alt Account
Banned
Apr 6, 2019
765
The only reason Stadia could be considered a bad deal is that people have (understandable) trust issues with a streaming licence.

Many people on era already articulated what the disadvantages of Stadia are.

License issues or the possibility to loose all your Stadia games if the service shuts down is not even very high on that list

No offline play, the need of the Stadia controller to have a chance for lag free controls, etc.

Other fear that the graphic quality could go down (lower resolution, or game settings to lower options) when many people use Stadia simultaneously, because Google will not really have one Stadia Virtual PC for every user.
 

IamFlying

Alt Account
Banned
Apr 6, 2019
765
DF tested the Stadia streaming regarding latency and the latency on AC Odyssey was like on the local XB1X version.

It was for DF test area, but unlike on XBox or other consoles, the gaming experience you have with Stadia at home can strongly vary, depending on your internet connection or just the time of the day, or how occupied the Stadia server are, for example in the evening many internet connections take a hit, when many people use the internet.
 

Pokemaniac

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,944
Stadia really just doesn't have a super great value proposition in general. All the latency, ownership, and preservation issues of game streaming, coupled with an exclusive library that can't even trade blows with Microsoft yet and trying to focus on "on-the-go" gaming in an era where the Nintendo Switch exists and is much better positioned to deliver on that since it isn't reliant on an Internet connection. About the only thing it has going for it is power, but even there, it loses out to a high end gaming PC, probably isn't going to look nearly as impressive compared to PS5 and Xbox Scarlett, and is probably going to cost more than a console long-term if you actually want to take advantage of that power by playing in 4k.
 

RestEerie

Banned
Aug 20, 2018
13,618
I'm a little out of the loop here, but if you buy a game for Stadia, you're paying for the ability to stream it--is that accurate? There's no download option?

there's no way to download because presumably, the game running in google stadia servers is not a windows binary...but a special linux build of the game.

unless users somehow managed to get hold of google's linux build and got the hardware to match, there's a negative 100% chance of that ever happening (nor is it technically feasible).

Unless they somehow manage to provide a windows version for users to download.....then how does the save game works then?
 

Alucardx23

Member
Nov 8, 2017
4,713
1. You don't need a Stadia controller
2. Once base Stadia is out, there's no need to pay $10 a month so long as you're fine with 1080p.
3. Google never promised Netflix for games, that was a fantasy conjured up by people who were enthralled at the idea of another tech giant entering the gaming space will SURELY enter the market with a Netflix for Games proposition, how could they ever do anything else!?
4. Yes, IMO Stadia as it stands proposition-wise? Quite unappealing. But it is what it is.

This is the type of information I need to see on every article that talks about the Stadia disadvantages. Someone doesn't talk about the Stadia Base being free, that not all games will be US$60, that the Stadia controller will not be necessary and that you don't have to pay every single month of Stadia Pro, has another agenda in my mind.
 

Golvellius

Banned
Dec 3, 2017
1,304
A dream scenario would be that they made a deal with Valve that games bought on Steam or on Stadia would sync up, both licenses and saves, so you could go back and fourth between the two services, like Play Anywhere with Xbox and Win 10. The best of both worlds.
So you think Stadia instances might switch to running Windows? Otherwise I can't see your suggestion being feasible.
 

thebishop

Banned
Nov 10, 2017
2,758
Stadia really just doesn't have a super great value proposition in general. All the latency, ownership, and preservation issues of game streaming, coupled with an exclusive library that can't even trade blows with Microsoft yet and trying to focus on "on-the-go" gaming in an era where the Nintendo Switch exists and is much better positioned to deliver on that since it isn't reliant on an Internet connection. About the only thing it has going for it is power, but even there, it loses out to a high end gaming PC, probably isn't going to look nearly as impressive compared to PS5 and Xbox Scarlett, and is probably going to cost more than a console long-term if you actually want to take advantage of that power by playing in 4k.

- We don't know that latency or "ownership" are actually issues.
- Preservation is not an issue for individual players, but the larger community.
- We don't know what Stadia's exclusive library is.
- It's a matter of preference whether Switch is "much better positioned" considering one purchase gets you a 4k60 living room experience as well as multiple portable options. Switch comes with major compromises.
- There's a lot more than just power "going for it", there's instant playing, playing on many devices, easy split screen implementation and more.
- Speculation about cost should take into account the cost of an online multiplayer subscription which comes out to like $5/mo, and mid-cycle hardware refreshes, which will happen automatically on Stadia
 

Raonak

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
2,170
So, if you're playing an online multiplayer game... unless the game supports crossplay, you're going to be restricted to the stadia audience?

Like destiny? you can only play with people who have it on stadia?
 

Deleted member 15395

Unshakable Resolve
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,145
I agree with the article on not being sure who exactly is this for...people that travel a lot? relatively low income households that cannot afford a dedicated console / pc?
 

kirbyfan407

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,114
So much discussion of Stadia is focused on its costs, yet there's a free tier. All you need is a controller. If you already are paying for the internet, that represents significant savings over other options.

Stadia isn't for me, but I have met multiple people who are casual gamers excited about the options it opens up for them.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,841
Because I have a gaming capable PC, Stadia has limited use to me. But if there is a game that comes out on Stadia but not PC, I will be happy to play it on Stadia. Thinking of Activision's mascot platformers and developers like Rockstar who keep delaying the PC version of their games for some reason.
 

Pokemaniac

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,944
- We don't know that latency or "ownership" are actually issues.
Of course they are. You can't have match the latency of the game running on similarly specced hardware locally, that's just physics. And ownership is of course an issue because all of your purchases go away as soon as the service dies.
- Preservation is not an issue for individual players, but the larger community.
If, hypothetically, a game I liked released exclusively on a streaming service, and the streaming service shut down, leaving me without the ability to play the game, how does that not affect me?
- We don't know what Stadia's exclusive library is.
So? We've seen what they've announced so far, and it does not inspire confidence. This isn't a topic where they get the benefit of the doubt that there might be something better later. Not without any history behind them.
- It's a matter of preference whether Switch is "much better positioned" considering one purchase gets you a 4k60 living room experience as well as multiple portable options. Switch comes with major compromises.
Switch actually delivers on a portable experience in ways that Stadia will probably never be capable of. I can play my Switch on the subway, trains, planes, etc. Stadia would be unusable in any of those scenarios.
- There's a lot more than just power "going for it", there's instant playing, playing on many devices, easy split screen implementation and more.
"easy split screen implementation" is a developer-focused bullet point that makes no sense to bring up in this conversation. Especially when that would likely require multiple nodes, if you're implying what I think you are, which is something I can't really see Google encouraging that much due to cost.

Playing on many devices and instant playing are fair bullet points, but are both fairly weak in the context of the overall weak offering. The need for a constant, high quality internet connection is going to limit the actual versatility of the offering compared to something like the Switch. The need for a separate controller to be paired with a phone or tablet is also going to be a pretty big limiting factor on the audience that reaches, as those aren't really something you see in the wild.

Instant playing is worth something, but not when I don't really want to use the platform to begin with. Also I can't image it's actually that much faster than the NVMe drive in my PC, or the ones it is increasingly sounding like might ship in Sony and Microsoft's next consoles.
- Speculation about cost should take into account the cost of an online multiplayer subscription which comes out to like $5/mo, and mid-cycle hardware refreshes, which will happen automatically on Stadia
All of those are optional.
 

Kyougar

Cute Animal Whisperer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
9,359
Another point against Stadia:

You could have 1TBit Internet but if you use shitty, spotty wifi, to play your games, you won't have a good time.
I called for 2 different ISP's in a call-center, and spotty WiFi was the number 1 reason people called.
The people called because their internet radio wasn't working properly with wifi on a 100mbit line.

You can bet that people want to use wifi several rooms away from the wifi router
 

Azurik

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Nov 5, 2017
2,441
I'm more than happy to sign up to stadia if it plays the coming games better than on consoles. Let's says CP2077 is announced for it and it looks better than on my x/ pro, I go with the stadia version.

I can see stadia as a stop gap until next gen comes out to enjoy the next games in better quality.